EOS R5 & R6 - Menu setting: Expo. Simulation: Disable/During/Enable not working.

[ABNpix]

Equipment:

Canon R5 and R6 (with multiple flashes & remote triggers):

Situation: 

Portrait of person in dark suit, indoors, 60 feet behind subject wall is lit by window light, one light soft box on subject.

My problem:  

I can not compose a photo while flash or strobes are engaged. While shooting a portrait (indoors) with flash or studio strobes (Profoto) via remote trigger on hot shoe, the exposure simulation does not seem to work. Menu setting: Expo. Simulation: I’ve used all three settings Disable/During/Enable and the same issue/results happen. If I view the subject (dark jacket) through camera LCD or EVF the monitor goes bright because monitor is trying to make a good visual exposure to view the dark subject which in turn blows out the background or if you angle the camera away from subject toward something bright the monitor goes dark to compensate for the brightness. 

When I take the photo the final image in camera is perfectly lit and exposed correctly - the issue is trying to view and compose the photo before I even take it.... The EVF/LCD is blown out/way over exposed so much so that I can’t compose the photo correctly (ie. Background, architectural lines coming out of persons head).  

If I turn OFF the flash -or- turn OFF the remote trigger then the viewable image on the LCD or EVF shows the correct exposure, the background is not blown out and I can see the architecture and compose the photo. 

If I turn the flash back ON or the trigger for remote, the EVF/LCD shows the background blown out (way over exposed, so much that I can not see what’s there)…. Impossible to compose a photo, it’s like being blind, this is unexceptable.  

Ive called CPS they said they don’t know why this happens (the tech even had the same camera & flash set up and saw the same issue I have)….  He had no answer or help for me.

I don’t know why the monitor shifts when the lens is pointed towards dark or light areas - it should not shift at all if I am shooting fully manual. Just because I turn on a flash the monitor shifts under and over exposed if you focus on bright or dark areas this does not seem correct. I personally can’t believe this has not been addressed or solved by now….   For $6,000.00 USD (R5$4k & R6$2k) I can’t believe this is even an issue…. My other mirrorless system LCD/EVF does not change at all when connected to strobes or flash, the LCD/EVF stays exactly where the manual exposure is set, even when I shift my view from dark to light areas.  

I look forward to any response or answers to the issue.  

Thank you all for your time. 

ABN

[NatalyaP]

Greetings ABNpix,

I can understand your frustration caused when composing your shot when shooting with flashes and strobes. I understand you have tried the different functions available under Exposure Simulation. When it comes to shooting with flashes, we do recommend on disabling Exposure Simulation.

You state you have already called our phone support team but in case you would like to continue troubleshooting then you may call them since phone support may have access to the equipment to troubleshoot it side by side with you. They can be reached at 1-800-652-2666, Monday through Friday between 9:00 am to 9:00 pm ET and Saturday between 9:00 am to 7:00 pm ET.

In the meantime, I have submitted your feedback to our engineers. Please note that decisions to update the function of the camera are made by our engineers and product designers in Japan, based on a number of factors. Consumer demand, technological limitations, and customer feedback are all taken into consideration.

[Dcamba]

Did you ever find a solution or workaround for this issue? I just got a speed light with the aim of using ICF to supplement ambient light indoors and I’m having the same issue you described where the lcd or viewfinder goes dark making it impossible to see to focus on my subject.

[p4pictures]

I think the cameras need a simulate with flash option to be added. In many cases people use flash in low light and that makes sense to disable the simulation so that the subject can be framed correctly and for AF to find and focus on the subject. However doing fill flash in bright light the lack of simulation is a problem, and currently none of the EOS R series have a setting for this. If you take a portrait of a person stood in front of a window with bright day light outside, and use a Speedlite to light the face, you have the camera trying to darken the overexposed background which renders the face too dark for the camera to do face / eye detection and so AF is a challenge also. 

[Waddizzle]

Using ExpSim with a flash does not work.  It is literally impossible to simulate the exposure without light source coming from the flash.  Use a light meter.  DSLRs experience similar issues when trying to use a flash in Live View mode, which is basically how an MILC body works.

“ If I view the subject (dark jacket) through camera LCD or EVF the monitor goes bright because monitor is trying to make a good visual exposure to view the dark subject which in turn blows out the background or if you angle the camera away from subject toward something bright the monitor goes dark to compensate for the brightness. “

What metering mode are you using?  What you are describing sounds perfectly normal.

[p4pictures]

There are cases where you combine flash and ambient light, and certainly exposure simulation cannot simulate the flash as it has not fired. In some situations it would be beneficial to see a simulation of the ambient light before the flash fires. In all the EOS R cameras I have tried, the histogram display is not shown when exposure simulation is disabled so the photographer has no sense of how the ambient will look if they are using a flash.

Here's a couple of situations to highlight the issue:-

1. Using a Speedlite to illuminate the face of a person indoors with bright windows behind them. Here with simulation disabled due to the flash, the camera shows the bright background behind the subject much darker than it will be captured - even with manual exposure on the camera - and makes the subject's face appear too dark. Sometimes if the subject is small or the background really bright the shadowed face is so underexposed that face / eye detection doesn't work effectively.
2. Using an off-camera flash behind the subject as a rim light. In this case the simulation / histogram is important to check the ambient exposure on the face. Since an off-camera Speedlite is used there is no histogram or exposure simulation available.

[Waddizzle]

Michael demonstrates the issue, and seems to have found a work around in the video.  He demonstrates the different ExpSim scenarios.  He shows what happes: when the Speedlite on or off, while metering is active or inactive.

[Dcamba]

I’m trying to take a picture of a subject in front of a window using my speed light (a Godoy V1) as OCF. I’m in full manual on my camera and flash. When I turn off exposure simulation my subject is too dark to see to be able to focus. I’m in spot metering mode. 

[Dcamba]

I did watch his video but it doesn’t address my issue. I’m not asking how to get a preview of the ambient light. I want to be able to see my subject well enough to grab focus and when the flash is turned on and my subject is backlit, my screen is too dark to focus. 

[usetape]

Here is the solution for anyone using a trigger for off camera flash and does not require e-ttl or hss. Put masking tape over the 4 pins of the flash or trigger that make a square together but leave the centre pin untaped. Voila. The camera will not recognize the trigger and/or flash as e-ttl capable and will (therefore?) not automatically disable exposure simulation when that flash/trigger is connected. We can turn exposure simulation off and on at will in all other circumstances. If I'm not mistaken, it would actually take EXTRA programming to not only turn off exposure simulation but also disable the feature entirely when a flash is connected. It boggles the mind. Now I have ugly masking tape on my beautiful pristine equipment to fix this. Thanks a lot, Canon. 

p.s. This has been a mandatory "feature" since I got a Canon EOS R in 2019. I now have an R6 with the same issue. They are obviously aware of it and aren't going to fix it. What's insane is that because it bothers me so much I would probably shell out for an EOS R5 just to not have a masking tape solution, BUT IT'S EVERY CAMERA IN THE LINEUP.

... and Sony does this, too. I don't know what the hell is going on.