Accidental Lens Release

[michaelgirman]

  My 24-105L just fell off my 5D mkIII and rolled into the Seine.  The lens release button is way too sensitive and it is so easy to accidentally unlock without realizing it.  I went to twist the zoom ring and the lens rotated and dropped off.  Blogs are full of compaints of this occurance on mkii's.  

  This is definitely a design flaw.  It's not user error.  The button should be relocated or made to require more force to release  or have a detent position.  

  It's a shame that you have to gaffer tape a $2300 lens to a $2000 camera.  Be forewarned.  

[Ron2]

This is not about how to avoid the issue. It is for Cannon to do something about it

I have shown how the problem happens and how to avoid the problem earlier with pictures on this thread

So thanks for the advice on how to avoid the problem but I think most on this forum already know how and shared

It only happens now with this new design of lens release button such as found on the 5D M3

The lens release button is bigger, protrudes from the lens 5mm more, is not partially recessed (protected) by the camera body, and according to some has a softer spring

Unsuspecting people not on this forum or others, will accidentally release lenses with this camera until its fixed

How big is the sample does not matter. Car manufacturers recall cars even if only 3 people in a million experience the issue

[Waddizzle]

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@Ron2 wrote:

This is not about how to avoid the issue. It is for Cannon to do something about it

I have shown how the problem happens and how to avoid the problem earlier with pictures on this thread

So thanks for the advice on how to avoid the problem but I think most on this forum already know how and shared

It only happens now with this new design of lens release button such as found on the 5D M3

The lens release button is bigger, protrudes from the lens 5mm more, is not partially recessed (protected) by the camera body, and according to some has a softer spring

Unsuspecting people not on this forum or others, will accidentally release lenses with this camera until its fixed

How big is the sample does not matter. Car manufacturers recall cars even if only 3 people in a million experience the issue

---

I'll tell you what.  Attach a lens to your camera, and hang it up inside of a closet.  Place something underneath it to catch the lens when it drops off.  Let it hang in the closet for an hour, a day, a week, a month, or a year or two.  

When the lens finally detaches and drops, I'll agree with you.  Until then, keep watching for it to drop.

[schmegg]

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@Waddizzle wrote:

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@Ron2 wrote:

This is not about how to avoid the issue. It is for Cannon to do something about it

I have shown how the problem happens and how to avoid the problem earlier with pictures on this thread

So thanks for the advice on how to avoid the problem but I think most on this forum already know how and shared

It only happens now with this new design of lens release button such as found on the 5D M3

The lens release button is bigger, protrudes from the lens 5mm more, is not partially recessed (protected) by the camera body, and according to some has a softer spring

Unsuspecting people not on this forum or others, will accidentally release lenses with this camera until its fixed

How big is the sample does not matter. Car manufacturers recall cars even if only 3 people in a million experience the issue

---

I'll tell you what.  Attach a lens to your camera, and hang it up inside of a closet.  Place something underneath it to catch the lens when it drops off.  Let it hang in the closet for an hour, a day, a week, a month, or a year or two.  

When the lens finally detaches and drops, I'll agree with you.  Until then, keep watching for it to drop.

---

You're missing the point.

We all know that there is some input required to the static camera system before the lens can come loose. No-one is arguing that.

What some of us find concerning is that the design, as it stands now, allows this to happen a little to 'accidentally'. In other words, it is a little too easy for a lens to come loose without purposeful, delibreate actions from the photographer.

Some of us feel that this is related to the larger, more prominent lens release button. We'd like that to be taken into consideration going forward.

Until then, I will continue to use my gear and, with more care, I will do my best, and probably succeed, in not having this happen again. Down the track, with my next body, I'd like to think this level of diligence won't be as necessary.

[Waddizzle]

Pushing the button alone does not release the lens.  In fact, you can fully press the button, release it, and the lens is still locked in place.  I'm not here to defend Canon.  I'm trying to make people understand that they need to accept some responsibility.

In order for a lens to release, the button must be pressed and held down, while the lens is rotated out of the locked position.  It takes a VERY specific SET of actions to unlock and remove a lens from a camera body.  If your lens dropped off your camera body, it's because you were careless.  It's just that simple, folks.

Now, can someone have a broken mount, which doesn't lock properly.  Sure.  If that is what you suspect, then get your camera checked out and repaired.  There is no manufacturing defect.  

[schmegg]

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Waddizzle wrote:

Pushing the button alone does not release the lens.  In fact, you can fully press the button, release it, and the lens is still locked in place.

Seriously - we all know this. Why you think we don't is beyond me, but I think all of us here understand what is required to release an EF mount lens from it's camera body.

I'm not here to defend Canon.  I'm trying to make people understand that they need to accept some responsibility.

Some responsbility accepted. But you are still missing the point.

In order for a lens to release, the button must be pressed and held down, while the lens is rotated out of the locked position.  It takes a VERY specific SET of actions to unlock and remove a lens from a camera body.  If your lens dropped off your camera body, it's because you were careless.  It's just that simple, folks.

And this is where we differ. I am not and was not "careless". I was using the equipment in a reasonable manner and in a manner that I have employed with other bodies over many outings. The fact that the lens came loose without my deliberate action is exactly what concerns me.

What we are saying is that, with a good design, this should not happen at all without the express, deliberate action of the photographer.

I believe firmly that a competent design would not allow a lens to come loose accidentally.

Now, can someone have a broken mount, which doesn't lock properly.  Sure.  If that is what you suspect, then get your camera checked out and repaired.  There is no manufacturing defect.  

Not sure about others, but I'm not claiming it is a defect. I'm claiming it's not as well designed as I think it should be. I'm careful with my gear and, if a lens can come loose given the way I work and treat my gear, then I feel the design is lacking.

I'd like the opportunity to bring this to the attention of Canon and others in the hope that this situation might change in future designs.

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[ebiggs1]

"...  that this situation might change in future designs."

I use Canon and Nikon gear daily and for 50+ years now.  I DO NOT  want it a tiny bit more difficult to change a lens.  So for all the efforts of some to petition for a change, I will resist.  There is nothing wrong with how it is now. Pay attention to what you are doing.

The fact someone mentioned this 'suspect fault' is reported more on Canon cameras is only because there are more Canon camera in use than any other brand. Probably more Canon than all the others combined.  And for good reason, too, as Canon as a whole package is the best there is.

Again, "Pay attention to what you are doing."

[John_SD]

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@ebiggs1 wrote:

"...  that this situation might change in future designs."

I use Canon and Nikon gear daily and for 50+ years now.  I DO NOT  want it a tiny bit more difficult to change a lens.  So for all the efforts of some to petition for a change, I will resist.  There is nothing wrong with how it is now. Pay attention to what you are doing.

The fact someone mentioned this 'suspect fault' is reported more on Canon cameras is only because there are more Canon camera in use than any other brand. Probably more Canon than all the others combined.  And for good reason, too, as Canon as a whole package is the best there is.

Again, "Pay attention to what you are doing."

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I don't believe that Canon would re-engineer a product because a few klutzes can't be bothered with learning proper camera-handling technique, the bedrock of which is paying attention to what you're doing. 

As a beginner, the first things I learned was proper camera- and lens-handling technique, followed by correct shooting stance. These basics seem to confound some users who, on the one hand, believe they are beyond such basics, yet on the other, struggle with dropped lenses and the like and demand that Canon idiot-proof their cameras to accomodate them. Sad. 

[Waddizzle]

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@schmegg wrote:

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@Waddizzle wrote:

Pushing the button alone does not release the lens.  In fact, you can fully press the button, release it, and the lens is still locked in place.

Seriously - we all know this. Why you think we don't is beyond me, but I think all of us here understand what is required to release an EF mount lens from it's camera body.

I'm not here to defend Canon.  I'm trying to make people understand that they need to accept some responsibility.

Some responsbility accepted. But you are still missing the point.

In order for a lens to release, the button must be pressed and held down, while the lens is rotated out of the locked position.  It takes a VERY specific SET of actions to unlock and remove a lens from a camera body.  If your lens dropped off your camera body, it's because you were careless.  It's just that simple, folks.

And this is where we differ. I am not and was not "careless". I was using the equipment in a reasonable manner and in a manner that I have employed with other bodies over many outings. The fact that the lens came loose without my deliberate action is exactly what concerns me.

What we are saying is that, with a good design, this should not happen at all without the express, deliberate action of the photographer.

I believe firmly that a competent design would not allow a lens to come loose accidentally.

Now, can someone have a broken mount, which doesn't lock properly.  Sure.  If that is what you suspect, then get your camera checked out and repaired.  There is no manufacturing defect.  

Not sure about others, but I'm not claiming it is a defect. I'm claiming it's not as well designed as I think it should be. I'm careful with my gear and, if a lens can come loose given the way I work and treat my gear, then I feel the design is lacking.

I'd like the opportunity to bring this to the attention of Canon and others in the hope that this situation might change in future designs.

---

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Let's be brutally honest.  Pressing the release button doesn't release the lens.  Period.  Twisting the lens barrel, doesn't release the lens, either.  The only set of events that release a lens from a properly working camera body is to hold down the release button, while twisting the lens barrel.  There is no other way for it to happen.  

Blaming the release button is a convenient excuse, that doesn't hold water, IMHO, because pressing the button does not release the lens.  The lens must also be turned, while the release button is held down.  I suggest that you try my closet experiment.  Make sure that you periodically press the lens release button, too.  Don't wait too long, though, because the lens is never going to drop of the camera body until you twist the lens barrel while pressing the release button.

There is nothing wrong with the design of the release.  I strongly advise that you open your mind to the possibility that the camera operator can actually unknowingly cause an accidental lens release.  I know.  I've done it before.

[Ron2]

I have answered all your questions.. 

But here are some answers again

Refer to the pictures posted on page 7 of the thread. (Yes I can hear you say "I told you there was a human involved")

Take a 5DM3 with a 24-70 lens, shoot down, Let the camera rest on your focusing hand. Humour me for a sec, rest the camera on your focusing hand (because there is no problem doing that on the mark 2 and mark 1 or 1D), 

It is only a problem on the 5D Mark 3

With the weight of the camera on your focus hand you wont know or feel that the lens release button has been accidentally pressed in by your index finger base knuckle

You also wont suspect it has been pressed in as this is unique to the 5D mark 3 so it has never happened before

Start to focus manually and the lens will be moving not the focus ring (its smooth action will feel like the focus ring moving)

Once the lens is on the move the button does not have to held in. You will be moving clockwise (from behind the camera) because that is what you do if the focus is against the stop one way you go the other way

There will be no focus through the view finder, but for the unsuspecting your reaction will be to move the lens more (because you are thinking you are moving the focus ring) and in no time the lens will come off.

A frequent and often needed photographic scenario (shooting down) aligns all the ducks in a row for this to happen on a M5D mark 3

Why in my opinon this is this a design flaw?

The latest 1DX has all the safe guards, the lens button is partially recessed in the camera body (so it is protected by the body and does not stick out from the lens 4-5 mm) and has a small but effective protection ring around its base

Two of the 1D’s protection design are on the earlier 5D Mark 2 and 1. 

None of the 1D, 5D mark 2 or 1 protection features are on the 5D Mark 3

If Cannon put back what they had on the Mark 2 & 1 and what they still have on the 1DX this "accidental lens release" will stop happening

For the question "now that you know what the problem is, just don’t do it”.   “duh” 

For the question it wont happen on its own, “duh” 

[ebiggs1]

Ron2,

You almost had me convinced, maybe just cause I had not done it, some thing might be happening.  But after reading that unfortunate series of events convinced me it is user error.  With out doubt!  Seriously?  This is the most convincing theory about a person not paying attention to what they are doing, I've heard.

"Take a 5DM3 with a 24-70 lens, shoot down, Let the camera rest on your focusing hand. Humour me for a sec, rest the camera on your focusing hand (because there is no problem doing that on the mark 2 and mark 1 or 1D), 

It is only a problem on the 5D Mark 3

With the weight of the camera on your focus hand you wont know or feel that the lens release button has been accidentally pressed in by your index finger base knuckle

You also wont suspect it has been pressed in as this is unique to the 5D mark 3 so it has never happened before

Start to focus manually and the lens will be moving not the focus ring (its smooth action will feel like the focus ring moving)

Once the lens is on the move the button does not have to held in. You will be moving clockwise (from behind the camera) because that is what you do if the focus is against the stop one way you go the other way

There will be no focus through the view finder, but for the unsuspecting your reaction will be to move the lens more (because you are thinking you are moving the focus ring) and in no time the lens will come off.

A frequent and often needed photographic scenario (shooting down) aligns all the ducks in a row for this to happen on a M5D mark 3"