Help with focus: Canon EOS R with EF 70-200mm f/2.8 IS II and adapter ring

[cdisimone]

I had been using the EOS 5D Mark II for quite sometime until I recently bought the Canon EOS R. Today I tried my EF 70-200mm f/2.8 IS II for the first time with the EOS R. Admittedly, this is my most underutilized lens so I don't have a lot of shots to compare to, but I got some seriously disappointing results today when just shooting objects in my yard. I had a lot of trouble focusing using the center focus point on the smallest setting. Maybe I am doing something wrong... looking for some guidance.

I have had tack sharp images with the other EF lenses I have tried with the EOS R so I'm hoping it is something I am doing... and that there is nothing wrong with the lens. My test shots were all handheld but on a pretty fast shutter speed, wide open and zoomed in at 200mm, and I was sitting and leaning my back against a wall so I should have been pretty still as well. I used single shot focus in the center and just snapped the photo.. no recomposing, no al servo, no choosing alternate focus points. Just center the subject and shoot. 

Can anyone tell me what is going wrong here? I didn't get one clear shot of the squirrel, or the bird.

Photo 1 (squirrel): https://flic.kr/p/2iNDbwc

Photo 1 Focus Point: https://flic.kr/p/2iNEVdP

Photo 2 (bird): https://flic.kr/p/2iNEUEV

Photo 2 Focus Point: https://flic.kr/p/2iNEVdo

If there's a better way to share photos here or if it's better to load right into this window, please let me know. I'm new here!

Thanks!

[rs-eos]

The subjects are both very tiny in the frame. Are you sure the lens didn't focus on say the leaves in the tree around the bird or an object close to the squirrel?

[cdisimone]

It is a possibility particularly with the bird but with the squirrel, the part of the grass that is in focus isn't anywhere near the squirrel. Even if I missed the squirrel and focused behind him, the in-focus grass would be further back, right? 

The subjects are small, but they did fill my focus point and I would think I'd be able to get them in focus. But yes it's possible. But I took a bunch of the squirrel and a bunch of the bird and NONE were in focus. I would think if it caught a leaf or a part of the grass, at some point it might catch focus on the squirrel or the bird.

I don't know, is it possible anything else is happening?

[Waddizzle]

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@cdisimone wrote:

I had a lot of trouble focusing using the center focus point on the smallest setting. 

I have had tack sharp images with the other EF lenses I have tried with the EOS R so I'm hoping it is something I am doing... and that there is nothing wrong with the lens.

My test shots were all handheld but on a pretty fast shutter speed, wide open and zoomed in at 200mm, and I was sitting and leaning my back against a wall so I should have been pretty still as well. I used single shot focus in the center and just snapped the photo.. no recomposing, no al servo, no choosing alternate focus points. Just center the subject and shoot. 

Can anyone tell me what is going wrong here? I didn't get one clear shot of the squirrel, or the bird.

If there's a better way to share photos here or if it's better to load right into this window, please let me know. I'm new here!

Thanks!

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I am not familiar with AF points in the EOS R.  Does "focus point on the smallest setting" mean spot focus?  Which shooting mode did you use?  All of these could have been shot in Av, Tv, or M modes.  I prefer M mode.

How fast of a shutter speed is "pretty fast shutter speed"?  I would use at least 1/1600 with squirrels and birds.  What was your ISO setting.  I am pretty sure that body can easily handle ISO 3200.

How far away were you?  Shooting wide open can create pretty narrow Depth-Of-Field at 200mm.  But, at 30 feet, you still should have had well over a foot of DoF..

I think your unfamiliarity with the lens may have been a factor.  The squirrel looks like camera shake, and the cardinal looks like focus hit a leaf, instead of the bird.  In both cases, the shutter could have been faster.

[cdisimone]

Hi, I was sitting pretty far from the squirrel but you can see the DOF in the grass behind the squirrel. I shot that at 1/2500sec, f3.2, ISO 2000. I had it on Tv for that one. The grass looks in focus so I don't know if it was camera shake.

I was a little closer to the bird than the squirrel. That was at 1/1250 sec, f2.8, ISO 1000, also Tv. More of a possibility here that I caught a leaf but... I just hope that's it!

On the EOS R when I say the "smallest setting" what I mean is, when you have it on spot focus, you can change the size of the point to a small point or a larger point. I had it on the smaller point. It's just a smaller focus box in the viewfinder. I would think with the smaller focus point I'd have enough precision to focus on both of these subjects, even though they are very small in the frame. 

[ebiggs1]

This is simple, you missed your focus point.

"...at 1/1250 sec, f2.8, ISO 1000, also Tv."

This is all OK except for birds and other smaller critters I prefer Av.  And, I would set aperture to f4 and ISO 1600 or even 3200 id needed. f2.8 is not going to give much of a margin of error in DOF if focus is missed by a tiny amount.

Curious why ISO 1000 instead of ISO 800 or ISO 1600?  Seems an odd ISO number.  BTW, shoot Raw with average WB. Keep in mind one of the things that you can't fix in post is missed focus.

[cdisimone]

I might have had ISO on Auto for that shot... These were just practice shots to see how the lens performed on the mirrorless camera and I was mainly concerned with keeping the shutter speed high for movement (mine and theirs), which is why I used Tv this time and didn't dial in the other settings or shoot in RAW. I can try again today at F4 and see if I can get any in focus.

I just can't understand how I missed the focus point though (with the squirrel), unless the focus point I am seeing in the camera is not truly where the camera is focusing. I had the focus point right over the squirrel.. I didn't half press and recompose or anything like that. Just centered the squirrel and full shutter press. If you look at the part of the grass that is in focus, it's between the 2 wood columns, not anywhere near the squirrel. If I missed the squirrel a little in any direction, the bucket might be in focus, or the part of the grass that is a little further back that is just over the squirrel's head. But for me to focus on the part of the grass that is in focus, I'd have to be way down and left or way down and right from center, right? It doesn't make sense to me how this happened, unless I moved the camera that much forward mid-shutter press, which I don't think is what happened.

I agree with you on the bird, it's very likely the camera picked up one of those leaves. But I am still surprised that in all my test shots, the camera didn't pick up on the bird one time, even though I had the focus point right on it. What aperture would I need to be at to get a clear shot of a bird in leaves like that?

Out of curiosity, what does it matter if an ISO is an "odd" ISO number if it allows you to get the other settings where you want them?

Thank you for your help!

[cdisimone]

It actually looks like maybe the camera focused on that root off to the right. But I was nowhere near that with my focus point. I wonder if the EOS R is doing something to "help" me focus on the correct subject and not fully listen to where I have my focus point locked. It does have features like facial recognition and eye-focus, but I had all of those things turned off. 

Will test again later. I will go place something in that bucket to focus on so I can replicate the same shot. I can also try with my 5D Mark ii.

Is there any chance something is wrong with the lens? Or more likely something wrong with me? 

[Waddizzle]

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@cdisimone wrote:

It actually looks like maybe the camera focused on that root off to the right. But I was nowhere near that with my focus point. I wonder if the EOS R is doing something to "help" me focus on the correct subject and not fully listen to where I have my focus point locked. It does have features like facial recognition and eye-focus, but I had all of those things turned off. 

Will test again later. I will go place something in that bucket to focus on so I can replicate the same shot. I can also try with my 5D Mark ii.

Is there any chance something is wrong with the lens? Or more likely something wrong with me? 

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I almost never use Spot AF Focus handheld, only on a tripod, and even then only rarely.  If I need to focus that accurately I will usually do it manually.  Have you looked at the AF Point(s) in Canon's DPP software?  It may give a tighter AF display in Spot AF Focus mode.

By definition, auto focus means the camera is helping you to focus.  In One Shot mode, it lock focus with the AF point that detects the closest object to the camera.  I assume that you know that already.  There could be something wrong with the lens, but I would tend to think not, though.  I would self examine what I am doing before I would blame the gear.

Check the lens settings, especially the focus distance setting and the IS Tracking Mode setting.

[ebiggs1]

"...what does it matter if an ISO is an "odd" ISO number..."

It doesn't.  Just 1000 is not a natural stop. 800 and 1600 are. Also the fact something is in focus tells you there isn't anything wrong with the lens.  It may need micro adjustment but it is focusing. The only other thing is you missed focus.

" I had the focus point right over the squirrel."

I think the problem here is the squirrel is so small.  Let's set up a test.  Do the very same settings and distance only put a larger subject in the shot.  A teddy bear for example. Try to keep everything the same except for the subject.  Also try different apertures to see which work best. I prefer to fix ISO. I don't use or like auto ISO.  I also prefer Av over Tv almost all the time.

Use One shot and just the center focus point for this test.  You can use jpg for this too.  Most of the time a jpg will be sharper right out of the camera than Raw.

"These were just practice shots to see how the lens performed on the mirrorless camera ..."

And that is exactly what we are going to do!  Don't be using any of the advanced stuff until this is done. Keep it simple and constant. You may find you like f4 or f5.6 better than f2.8.