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Occasional Contributor
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎11-06-2020

Color Shift adjustment for 90D

[ Edited ]

I am struggling with how color shift correction works. First I shoot a RAW image, then open in Adobe Camera RAW, As Shot. And no matter what I have the Color Temp set at in camera, it always shows a different value. AND the real problem is that the TINT is always up around +19 Magenta and needs to be around +22. I have tried adjustments in the "WB Shift" menu but I cannot figure out what is really happening. I can find no info online that explains how to test for and correct any bias my camera sensor has. Right now I am simply guessing by looking at many shots of various items.

 

If I set the WB to 5500K the Camera shows something like 6400K "as shot" Why does Camera RAW not show the actual camera settings "as shot"? I have no starting point to evaluate what the camera is doing.

 

I'm trying to calibrate the camera so I can accurately evaluate LED lighting I am using. Just like my monitor, calibration is essential to getting accurate color.

VIP
Posts: 11,419
Registered: ‎08-13-2015

Re: Color Shift adjustment for 90D

[ Edited ]

I suggest that you contact Adobe regarding your issues with image imports.  Apparently, Adobe is not reading the EXIF data properly for one reason or another.  Have you tried using the Adobe Color Space in the camera?  Just a long shot.

 

Meanwhile, I suggest that you consider buying the X-Rite ColorChecker [**bleep**].  You can biuild a Color Profile for your specific cameras.  Instead of selecting "Adobe Standard", the name of your camera will appear.  If you calibarate your monitor, then you would want to calibrate the color reproduction coming off of your image sensor.

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"Doctor told me to get out and walk, so I bought a Canon."
Honored Contributor
Posts: 7,793
Registered: ‎11-13-2012

Re: Color Shift adjustment for 90D

[ Edited ]

Welcome to the forum.

 

Following is my understanding. Others should join in as well.

 

When you set a white balance setting in the camera all you are doing is adding a tag in the RAW file metadata. The actual RAW file data and histogram are unaffected by any WB you select. You are simply recording what you believe the color temperature of the light to be.

 

When you select As Shot in ACR you are telling the software to use the file data as-shot to compute the white balance of the image; it will do its best io render a neutral image.

 

See this discussion at https://fastrawviewer.com/white-balance-as-per-channel-exposure-correction

 

[This link is okay, so we edited it to be clickable.]

John Hoffman
Conway, NH

1D X Mark III, Many lenses, Pixma PRO-100, MX472, LR Classic
VIP
Posts: 11,419
Registered: ‎08-13-2015

Re: Color Shift adjustment for 90D


@jrhoffman75 wrote:

Welcome to the forum.

 

Following is my understanding. Others should join in as well.

 

When you set a white balance setting in the camera all you are doing is adding a tag in the RAW file metadata. The actual RAW file data and histogram are unaffected by any WB you select. You are simply recording what you believe the color temperature of the light to be.

 

When you select As Shot in ACR you are telling the software to use the file data as-shot to compute the white balance of the image; it will do its best io render a neutral image.

 

See this discussion at https://fastrawviewer.com/white-balance-as-per-channel-exposure-correction

 

[This link is okay, so we edited it to be clickable.]


"If I set the WB to 5500K the Camera shows something like 6400K "as shot" Why does Camera RAW not show the actual camera settings "as shot"? I have no starting point to evaluate what the camera is doing.

 

John, I do not experience his problem.  When I set 5200 in the camera, I get 5200 in Lightroom.  Maybe there is a difference with ACR, or ACR needs to be updated.

 

I agree with you.  When you select "As Shot" the file data is what should be used.  Apparently, this is not what is happening.

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"Doctor told me to get out and walk, so I bought a Canon."
Occasional Contributor
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎11-06-2020

Re: Color Shift adjustment for 90D

I will purchase the ColorChecker... thanks for your input.

 

I have not tried the Adobe Color space. Overall I am functioning OK with all this but I do feel there is an issue with calibration of the sensor which I need to understand. Not too worried about Blue/Yellow color temp slider, but the Magenta/Green slider is where I believe I have an issue. I think the camera may be a bit too Magenta. Not sure how to determine that. Opening in Camera RAW is not helpful because of the wild numbers it throws up. If I shoot a neutral white foam core board, and set exposure to around the middle on histogram, Camera RAW shows a magenta setting of +19 and the image is slightly magenta. Moving the slider to green removes the cast but slider still at around +15'

 

I just do not understand what the Color Info in Camera RAW is actually telling me about the image.

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎11-06-2020

Re: Color Shift adjustment for 90D

Thanks!! I am looking over the info in the link you sent. Difficult to understand. I will read it again.

I guess my trouble stems from not understanding what the Camera RAW color info is actually telling me. How do I use this to gain some insight into how my sensor may or may not be off. No matter what settings I use for White Balance in the camera, the color sliders in Camera RAW don't seem to be making sense regarding that color balance.

 

Almost as if Camera RAW is using it's own computation for what the actual color balance was when shot. I assumed that if I put the Camera WB on 5500K camera RAW would show that exeact number when I select "as shot"

 

I am using an X-Rite i1 Display Pro monitor calibrator and colors is right on, so I need to calibrate the camera I guess... just hoping there is a procedure for getting close without spending a fortune.

 

Something like this: Shoot a known neutral card, open in camera RAW or Lightroom and boost the  saturation until noticeable, adjust camera WB Shift Green/Magenta as needed. Repeat test.

 

Thanks for your help!

VIP
Posts: 11,419
Registered: ‎08-13-2015

Re: Color Shift adjustment for 90D

Does this happen with other camera bodies, or is it specific to your 90D.

 

Adobe has to make a best estimate of how Canon processes their images.

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"Doctor told me to get out and walk, so I bought a Canon."
Occasional Contributor
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎11-06-2020

Re: Color Shift adjustment for 90D

I had 2 40D's but sold them recently... currently also own an 80D and I think it does the same. Can't remember exactly but similar.
Honored Contributor
Posts: 7,793
Registered: ‎11-13-2012

Re: Color Shift adjustment for 90D


@Waddizzle wrote:

@jrhoffman75 wrote:

Welcome to the forum.

 

Following is my understanding. Others should join in as well.

 

When you set a white balance setting in the camera all you are doing is adding a tag in the RAW file metadata. The actual RAW file data and histogram are unaffected by any WB you select. You are simply recording what you believe the color temperature of the light to be.

 

When you select As Shot in ACR you are telling the software to use the file data as-shot to compute the white balance of the image; it will do its best io render a neutral image.

 

See this discussion at https://fastrawviewer.com/white-balance-as-per-channel-exposure-correction

 

[This link is okay, so we edited it to be clickable.]


"If I set the WB to 5500K the Camera shows something like 6400K "as shot" Why does Camera RAW not show the actual camera settings "as shot"? I have no starting point to evaluate what the camera is doing.

 

John, I do not experience his problem.  When I set 5200 in the camera, I get 5200 in Lightroom.  Maybe there is a difference with ACR, or ACR needs to be updated.

 

I agree with you.  When you select "As Shot" the file data is what should be used.  Apparently, this is not what is happening.


I think you are correct Waddizzle; I misunderstood what I read about the import action.

 

But therer does seem to be something possibly going on with the .CR3 files. There is some sort of battle going on between Adobe and Canon. There are no camera specific profiles for cameras with .CR3 files later than the 5D Mark IV  and the R5.

 

here is a screenshot for a 1D X Mark I.

 

DPP shows that WB was set to Tungsten.  1D X manual says Tungsten is 3200K  LrC says 3200 As-Shot.

 

DPP.jpg

 

Here is a screenshot for a file from the 1D X Mark III.

 

As Shot.jpg

 

LrC reports a different value.

 

 

John Hoffman
Conway, NH

1D X Mark III, Many lenses, Pixma PRO-100, MX472, LR Classic
VIP
Posts: 13,791
Registered: ‎12-07-2012

Re: Color Shift adjustment for 90D

You know just for kicks and grins, reset everything.  Reset your camera to factory default. Make sure there are no presets in PS, ACR or LR. In PS reset preferences (do this in the Preferences Dialog Box). Do the same for LR (Alt+Shift as you start Lightroom in Windows some other keys in Mac).

 

In ACR, when you hold down Alt key you can click Reset. The Cancel key becomes a Reset key (in Windows some other keys in Mac). 

EB
EOS 1DX and 1D Mk IV and several lenses!
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