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Lens choice advice please for travel, wildlife, nature, and general photography

cbloom
Apprentice

Question about lens for travel/wildlife/nature and general photography:

Recently purchased an R10 with the RF-S18-45mm kit lens and trying to figure out the best route to go.

RF-S 18-45mm F4.5-6.3 IS STM & RF-S55-210mm F5-7.1 IS STM & RF 100-400mm F5.6-8 IS USM

OR

RF-S18-150mm F3.5-6.3 IS STM & RF 100-400mm F5.6-8 IS USM

The 18-150mm & 100-400mm would cost $167.12 more total.

Also, RF 100-400mm F5.6-8 IS USM x 1.6 (APS-C) would be 160-640mm F8.96-12.8, is this correct?

7 REPLIES 7

ebiggs1
Legend
Legend

"RF-S18-150mm F3.5-6.3 IS STM & RF 100-400mm F5.6-8 IS USM"

That combo form yout prefered list.

EB
EOS 1DX and 1D Mk IV and less lenses then before!

p4pictures
Authority
Authority

I would also select the RF-S 18-150mm lens and the RF 100-400mm lens for your EOS R10. 

firstly I have the RF-S 18-150mm lens on my EOS R10 and I love it. It is physically longer than the RF-S 18-45mmm but overall it so small and compact that I think it's a perfect walk around lens.

Your EOS R10 camera is a crop sensor camera, meaning it has an APS-C size sensor. This means that it only "sees" the central part of the lens, so it's like taking a 1.6x crop from a full-frame image. This 1.6x factor can be applied to all lenses fitted to the camera to see how their angle of view changes. For example the RF-S 18-150mm has the field of view of a 28.8 to 240mm lens on a full-frame camera. However the crop factor does not affect the aperture of the lens. So this means the angle of view of the RF 100-400mm is similar to a 160 to 640mm lens on a full-frame camera, but you keep the aperture F5.6-8.

So with the two lens kit you reduce the need to switch lenses, and have a setup that covers from 18 to 400mm in actual focal length, but has the angle of view of a 28.8mm to 640mm setup on a full-frame camera.

You might be able to trade your exiting RF-S 18-45mm lens when making the deal for two lenses with a bricks and mortar store.

 


Brian
EOS specialist trainer, photographer and author
-- Note: my spell checker is set for EN-GB, not EN-US --

stacey45
Apprentice
  1. Versatile and Budget-Friendly: RF-S 18-45mm F4.5-6.3 IS STM and RF-S 55-210mm F5-7.1 IS STM.
  2. More Telephoto Reach: RF-S 18-150mm F3.5-6.3 IS STM and RF 100-400mm F5.6-8 IS USM.

The 100-400mm lens on an R10 becomes 160-640mm with a reduced aperture of F8.96-12.8. Choose based on your needs and budget.

“ The 100-400mm lens on an R10 becomes 160-640mm with a reduced aperture of F8.96-12.8. Choose based on your needs and budget. “

“ However the crop factor does not affect the aperture of the lens. So this means the angle of view of the RF 100-400mm is similar to a 160 to 640mm lens on a full-frame camera, but you keep the aperture F5.6-8. “

Brian and Ernie are correct.

The aperture doesn’t change.  This is an idea promoted by just a few content creators on YouTube.  I am not aware of any hard copy books that promote the idea, but that is not saying one doesn’t exist.  

 

--------------------------------------------------------
"The right mouse button is your friend."

I would agree that the physical aperture of a lens does not change.  The challenge comes when considering the equivalent values to compare the performance of a lens on a crop-sensor camera, as opposed to that of the same lens on a full-frame camera under the same circumstances.
I will stress that the physical focal length and aperture of a lens do NOT change.  That is not the issue, it's about the interaction of the lens and sensor when producing a result . 

To quote the article from DPReview by Richard Butler:
“You do not have to multiply the f-number by the crop factor, unless you want to understand its behaviour, relative to another system, considering the combined effect of the aperture and sensor size."

In the same way that Equivalent focal lengths describe the effect of sensor size on the field-of-view a lens gives, Equivalent apertures describe the effect of sensor size on the properties that aperture affects (depth of field, diffraction, total light projected). In both instances, the underlying properties are not changed: neither the focal length or F-number of a lens is changed by different sensor sizes, only their effects.

  • f/number = focal length/aperture diameter
  • Equivalent f/number = equivalent focal length/aperture diameter

Comparing equivalent apertures allows you to understand how much control a lens will give you over depth-of-field. It also gives a good idea of how low-light performance will compare between two cameras of different sensor sizes, since it tells you how much total light is making up the final image (most noise in most images comes from the amount of light captured).  "

This is previously explored by Richard Butler in his DPReview article:  What is equivalence and why should I care?  Published Jul 7, 2014 – To quote:
“Conveniently, it's become fashionable for manufacturers to produce 85mm equivalent, F1.2 lenses, which makes it relatively easy to demonstrate the ways in which they are, and aren't equivalent.

Tronhard_0-1732642536514.png"

In a You Tube video, Tony Northrop demonstrated this effectively - although I disagree with his presentation, as he falls into the trap of poor terminology in that the focal lengths and apertures do not change, but to achieve the same Depth of Field, the crop sensor does have an impact:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5zN6NVx-hY

This is firmly upheld by the Gaussian Lens Formula, as explained by Prof Marc LeVoy, Emeritus Prof in optics and computational photography at Stanford:

Tronhard_1-1732643097736.png

The dispute has always been a bugbear because folks don't separate the difference between physical characteristics of the gear - in this case focal length and aperture, as opposed to their effect when combined with a sensor that crops the resultant projected image.

In effect, each camp is correct within limitations. Focal length and aperture are physical characteristics and as such stay constant within the gear.  It is the result of combining those characteristics with a different size sensor that creates differences in Field of View and Depth of Field, both of which are heavily impacted by sensor size.
For a full explanation of this see: Equivalence.   

Really, this is because the terminology is poor, confusing and misused: resulting in a needless and apparently endless debate - we are essentially arguing 'apples and oranges'.


cheers, TREVOR

The mark of good photographer is less what they hold in their hand, it's more what they hold in their head;
"All the variety, all the charm, all the beauty of life is made up of light and shadow", Leo Tolstoy;
"Skill in photography is acquired by practice and not by purchase" Percy W. Harris

ebiggs1
Legend
Legend

"The 100-400mm lens on an R10 becomes 160-640mm with a reduced aperture of F8.96-12.8. Choose based on your needs and budget."

Total nonsense it doesn't "become" anything it is not. The only thing that is different on a cropper vs a full frame (FF) is the angle of view (AOV). Nothing else, nothing more. This is clearly pointed out by Brian ..."For example the RF-S 18-150mm has the field of view of a 28.8 to 240mm lens on a full-frame camera. However the crop factor does not affect the aperture of the lens."

It is also a hotly debated topic as to whether a lens on a cropper is better for tele work or to simply to crop the same image using the same lens from a FF in post editing. I find that to be a case by case and camera vs camera situation with no clear answer.

EB
EOS 1DX and 1D Mk IV and less lenses then before!

Ron888
Enthusiast

Given that the 18-150 has a good reputation for image quality (or at least not WORSE than the 18-45), there is no disadvantage there.
Thus the 18-150 + 100-400 would be the preferred choice if you want convenience.Most of the time that is.
But there's no real image quality disadvantage with the 18-45 +55-210 +100-400 set so feel free to go either way

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