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Confused about DPP4 use of color profiles

aajax
Enthusiast

I've been using DPP4 for some time now to develop raw image files from my Canon cameras. Have also tried some other post processing software which is open source. The other software makes color profiles a pretty integral part of using the software. This includes both ICC and DCP profiles. In the case of DCP, which are produced by Adobe, there is a large set of camera specific profiles to include for my Canon cameras. They include multiple profiles for each camera which appear to correspond to the picture styles supported by the applicable camera.

One expectation I've had when using DPP4 is that it knows the specific details for my particular camera and develops the pictures accordingly. While it has features that relate to picture styles there is NO mention anywhere of profiles (i.e., color profiles). When I search through the files contained in the software I can NOT find anything that looks to be camera specific.

Are there color profiles (maybe ICC type) that correspond to my specific cameras?  and maybe Picture Style?  If NOT might there be some kind of documentation that explains how DPP4 adapts to the specific camera model?

6 REPLIES 6

Danny
Moderator
Moderator

Hi, aajax!

So that the Community can help you better, we need to know exactly which Canon camera models you're using. That, and any other details you'd like to give will help the Community better understand your issue!

If this is a time-sensitive matter, click HERE search our knowledge base or find additional support options HERE.

Thanks and have a great day!

aajax
Enthusiast

I have a pair of cameras that I think are essentially the same.  Canon calls one a "Rebel T6' and the other "1300D".  The raw files from these represent my real experience in post processing.  I just acquired a new camera that Canon brands as an "EOS R".  This is what has caused me to start wanting to know more about how the software distinguishes the difference between cameras.

Greetings, aajax

Digital Photo Professional 4 will use the color space that has been designated by the camera when taking the picture where the two options are either sRGB or Adobe RGB.

For reviewing the color management of Digital Photo Professional 4, you may open the Preferences window through the Tools option on the top menu bar. Selecting Color management will provide you with the available options for the work color space, the color matching settings, and printing profiles. The software does not allow users to apply or change the color profiles outside of what is available within this preference window.

You may review the following link for more information on the color space that is available through our software:

https://cam.start.canon/en/S002/manual/html/UG-14_Reference_0050.html

Well I have used the preferences the specify color profiles for both my calibrated display and Canon printer paper (i.e., soft proofing).  What's seems to be missing is how the camera is accounted for.

I don't claim to be an expert on color management but all other (actually several others I've used) post-processing software provides for specifying a camera specific input profile.  I had the idea that the difference between sRGB & AdobeRGB pertained to choosing a color space within which we wanted the camera to operate.  However, my understanding of raw data is that the camera is NOT involved in doing such development.  However, the sensor is the device that differs from camera to camera that does have an affect on the raw data and that the post-processing software can function better when taking this into account.

Sounds like you are saying NOT SO in the case of DPP4.  Yes?

Hazel_T
Product Expert
Product Expert

Hi aajax,

It is a little bit of both. The camera processor and sensor set the initial values for things like color. Different cameras can have slightly different color from each other since they use different sensors. The color space tells the camera and software what color space to choose those values from. 

When you are shooting in RAW the amount of developing the camera does is minimal. With those files most of the color rendering is done in post with editing software. Different software use different codecs and ICC profiles, so the same file can have different color values when you open it in multiple pieces of editing software.

Some software allows you to choose the ICC profile you want to use. In Digital Photo Professional the ICC profile is set once a RAW file is being converted to either TIFF or JPG. When that is done the software is using the profile information it has for the camera body and preferences for the color space and picture style you selected. There is not a way to manually select the camera profile you want to use in Digital Photo Professional. It is automatically applied by the software.

Based on my experience with other (than DPP4) post-processing software there are 3 different kinds of profiles the pertain to raw processing. They are referred to as Input Profile, Working Profile, and Output Profile.

Output Profile is the ICC Profile that gets embedded into the metadata (if desired) for the resulting image file.

Working Profile pertains to the color space used during editing.

As I understand it Input Profile pertains to the camera used to shoot the picture, which I assume to relate to the sensor since NOT much else matters in the case of raw files.

DPP4 allows some choice for Working Profile. Those choices appear to be sRGB (default I think), Adobe RGB, Wide Gamut RGB, Apple RGB, and Color Match RGB. I don't see any way to specify or choose an Output Profile. What I get in the resulting image files is an ICC profile named "sRGB v1.31 (Canon)". However, there is NO mention anywhere about an Input Profile.

In the case of Rawtherapee (example of other post-processing software) it is possible to select DNG Color Profiles (i.e., .dcp files) which are produced and distributed by Adobe. It is believed that these files serve the same purpose for the various Adobe products that support post-processing of raw files. Apparently, these files do NOT conform to the ICC standards for color profiles but, I believe, they contain the equivalent information plus some. These DCP Profiles are camera specific and there may be several for each camera that appear to relate to the various picture styles that the camera offers and is presumed to pertain to what gets used by the camera to produce camera developed jpg files in those picture styles.

Insofar as these DCP Profiles are produced by Adobe rather than Canon it certainly is fair to question how they go about creating such files for all of the vendors whose cameras are supported by their software. One would be inclined to think that all of the various camera manufacturers assist with this effort. However, I can provide no evidence to that effect.

In summary, it does seem to me that Canon does NOT need to produce individual profile files that conform to the ICC standard (i.e., ICC Profiles) in order provide the equivalent information to its' own software. However, it would seem that Canon could/should be willing to inform its' customers about how this is done. That might be all I'm asking for!

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