topic Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise (?) in Point & Shoot Digital Cameras

Powershot SX170, too much noise

musicus — Sat, 08 May 2021 22:48:25 GMT

I am getting a continual problem on my videos. Too much noise.

This can be seen here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xODkPppDbcU

'Noise" might not be the most accurate word - but what I mean

is the "activity" that is ever-present. I see this even when I use

spotlight on other vids. I am mostly concerned with indoor videos

with moderate lighting. Any ideas on aperture, ISO settings, HD, etc?

Thanks.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

Waddizzle — Sun, 09 May 2021 01:15:43 GMT

You need to add additional lighting.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

rs-eos — Sun, 09 May 2021 02:40:31 GMT

There are three main things resulting in the poorer video quality:

The equipment itself; your camera has a small sensor. As such, unless you have lots of good lighting, it won't lead to higher quality. Though there will be a limit to what this camera can do.

The codec used to record the video. Consumer cameras actually toss out lots of information and then tend to use very heavy compression.

The compression applied by YouTube.

Unfortunately, you're stuck with the codec (consumer equipment typically just has one type). But, you can, as mentioned earlier, try to add more lighting. I would also use a shutter as low as possible. Typically you want the 180-degree rule. And if your camera allows for it, I would recommend shooting at 24 fps (actually this will be 23.976, but that's a whole other discussion). For the sake of this post, I'll write 24. So shutter can be 1/48 second. This will give you for light-gathering performance over using 30 fps with a shutter of 1/60. Small, but still worthwhile.

For aperture, you'll want the widest possible and that typically means widest angle of the lens (least zoomed in).

Last restort is ISO; set that as low as possible. Typically professional video equipment have native ISOs (e.g. 800), but I think for typical photo cameras that also capture video, lower ISO is better.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

Nick2020 — Sun, 09 May 2021 05:10:30 GMT

Hi musicus,

Thanks for checking in!

The suggestions on here from others have been valid points, in particular keeping the ISO as low as possible while still getting a proper exposure is one of the best things you can do on the camera side to reduce noise.

I will add that if you find yourself shooting more videos, you might think about upgrading to a camera with a larger image sensor like the PowerShot G1X Mark III, which has an APS-C CMOS sensor, like many of our DSLRs. Generally speaking, the larger the image sensor, the better the camera will be at capturing detail with less noise, especially in low-light conditions.

A newer processor can also help. The PowerShot SX170 IS uses our DIGIC 4 processor, while the G1X Mark III has our DIGIC 7 processor. To learn more about our G-series PowerShots, check out the link below:

https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/explore/powershot-g-series/powershot-g1-x-mark-iii

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

rs-eos — Sun, 09 May 2021 12:00:49 GMT

Got sidetracked a bit during my earlier reply... Regarding shutter, while 180-degree rule is very common, you could also slow the shutter further in order to reduce ISO. Note though that motion will appear different. Anyhow, use 1/24 (1/25) shutter for 24 fps movies. And 1/30 shutter for 30 fps movies.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise (?)

musicus — Sun, 09 May 2021 18:31:58 GMT

Thank you, I appreciate your taking the time to respond. I think I need to be

sure that my using the word "noise" is correct. So I'm linking or attaching a

few examples of videos I took with my Powershot. I would like to know

whether any of these could be considered visually unacceptable ("noise?") by most

viewers, in your opinion. I know they could all be sharper, of course. (Note: I only used

one camera so I don't know whether the 180 degree rule applies.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVvLQvW_YWw

This is zoomed not from Powershot but from iMovie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcZGBY45m9o

Notice the "activity" on the right side of the piano (lower

R corner of the frame)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xODkPppDbcU

Within the first few seconds notice the "activity" during the

zoom. Zoom was done with iMovie.

I will try to check out your three main suggestions regarding

frames per second, aperture and zooming, to see how to

access this on the camera. Looking forward to your reply.

Thanks.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

musicus — Sun, 09 May 2021 18:25:19 GMT

Thanks. I am trying to make sure that my use of the word "noise" is correct so I have posted three examples:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVvLQvW_YWw

This is zoomed not from Powershot but from iMovie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcZGBY45m9o

Notice the "activity" on the right side of the piano (lower

R corner of the frame)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xODkPppDbcU

Within the first few seconds notice the "activity" during the

zoom. Zoom was done with iMovie.

I want to make sure that I have done everything possible on my Powershot

before I go out and spend big bucks on another camera. Do any of the above

videos appear to be visually unacceptable to you? Of course I know they could all be

sharper. Thanks.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

musicus — Sun, 09 May 2021 18:30:10 GMT

I only used one camera so I don't know whether the 180 degree rule applies.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

Waddizzle — Sun, 09 May 2021 18:56:52 GMT

It sounds like your issue only appears when you zoom into the frame using iMovie. Sounds like an editing software issue.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

rs-eos — Sun, 09 May 2021 19:08:09 GMT

My fault for mentioning it as the "180 degree rule". Yea, that involves filming a typical scene of a conversation between two people.

Anyhow, I should have used "180 degree shutter angle". That means to use a shutter that is one over double the frame rate. So for 24 fps movies, you'd use 1/48 s (1/50 s) shutter. And for 30 fps movies, you'd use 1/60 s shutter.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

rs-eos — Sun, 09 May 2021 19:07:38 GMT

In terms of what I personally see in the videos... I see noise, but also a decent amount of compression artifacts. YouTube is definitely making things worse since you have a second-generation video. The vast majority of video compression is lossy. Meaning that everytime it is transfered to another system and re-saved, more information is lost leading to lower quality.

Consumer video equipment, as I mentioned earlier, end up using so many compromises in order to reduce heat and reduce file sizes when capturing video. Most have smaller sensors as well, which even in outdoor shots, don't produce as clean of an image as when using equipment with larger sensors (specifically the size of individual photo sites).

Only you can be the judge of it the footage is good enough for your purposes. Personally, I don't see anything really wrong with them.

Also note that if wanting ultimate quality, that can come in at a massive cost. I was recently toying with the idea of getting the Canon EOS C70. A massive step up in terms of video quality over my Vixia HF G50, but also around 10 times the price for a single-lens setup.

Re: Powershot SX170, too much noise

musicus — Sun, 09 May 2021 19:09:24 GMT

Thanks, I appreciate that.