topic Can an old DSLR learn new tricks? in Share Your Photos

Can an old DSLR learn new tricks?

deebatman316 — Sat, 28 Jun 2025 17:30:29 GMT

What do you think we can do with older DSLRs, EF/ EF-S lenses & speedlites.

Gear: EOS 40D, EF 50mm F/1.8 STM & Speedlite 550EX

Tv: 1/250th sec, Av: F/1.8, ISO 160

Re: Can an old DSLR learn new tricks?

zakslm — Sat, 28 Jun 2025 18:28:19 GMT

"What do you think we can do with older DSLRs, EF/ EF-S lenses & speedlites."

Demetrius,

Well done and I certainly agree!

Nice shots!

A while ago, I experimented using the pop up flash on my T7 for fill flash on close up/macro shots to fill in the shadows and liked the results. Then I got the idea of using my 430EX for fill set setting the flash for high speed sync and again , liked the results. It worked well on my T7 and works well on my 90D.

Further refining the technique, when I'm pretty close or in macro range, I flip down the diffuser on the 430EX and set the flash to -2/3 stop flash expsoure compensation and I get some interesting shots. It makes the subject stand out from the background.

Canon EOS 90D, EF-S60mm f2.8 macro, 430EX Speedlite

Re: Can an old DSLR learn new tricks?

deebatman316 — Sat, 28 Jun 2025 19:12:39 GMT

I’ve found that I actually get better metering with older speedlites on newer cameras. Then I ever did on older cameras. Its even more apparent on Mirrorless Cameras now. My friend used to have over and underexposed shots in E-TTL mode with an old 420EX & EOS 10D. But on my EOS 5D Mark IV & 420EX. I’ve never had overexposed shots or drastically underexposed. Sometimes depending on the shooting situation I’ll add or subtract FEC if I know the camera will be fooled. But this really isn’t the case anymore. I had to do that with my old EOS 40D. I usually take a shot and look at it to see if it’s correctly exposed before adding or subtracting FEC.

Re: Can an old DSLR learn new tricks?

zakslm — Sun, 29 Jun 2025 00:42:11 GMT

Demetrius,

I think you're on to something with "older speedlites on newer cameras". I think newer cameras are "smarter" or use "smarter flash exposure" that is camera dependent and not speedlite dependent. For instance, when I look at the EXIF information on a shot taken with the 90D where a flash (pop up or speedlite) was fired, there is an entry that says, "E-TTL II flash metering Eval (FacePrty)". Shots with flash from my T7 say "E-TTL II flash metering Evaluative flash metering". I'd be curious to know what the EXIF data says from a 10D shot taken with flash from a speedlite or the pop up flash.

So I'm thinking that older bodies with older Digix processors maybe like the 10D have less sophisticated E-TTL II evaluative flash metering than your 5D Mark IV and the Digix processor therein or the firmware is not as refined. You've already observed a difference in the consistency of the results.

Maybe I'm stating the obvious and geeking out a bit. But the consistency of results when using flash have come a long way since I shot slide film using a Canon 155A Speedlite or a Vivitar 283 flash on my AE-1 or T70.

Regards,

Larry Zaks

Re: Can an old DSLR learn new tricks?

deebatman316 — Sun, 29 Jun 2025 01:37:10 GMT

E-TTL II was released in 2004 with the EOS-1D Mark II. Older cameras that utilized E-TTL relied on focus points for shots. The EOS 10D used the original E-TTL flash system. The EOS 10D also used the original Digic processor. Cameras before it were pre-Digic. E-TTL II doesn't rely on focus points another method is used to calculate exposure. Also the lens if equipped will provide focus distance information. This is NOT used for wireless flash. Also auto flash exposure happens in the camera body. So all the flash does is fire a pre-flash and the camera determines what flash power is needed. Then the flash fires at the power level the camera requested. Old Auto thyristor type flashes had sensor or "electronic eye" on the flash to determine flash power. The sensor would detect the light level and turn the flash off when necessary. This is not Through The Lens flash metering at all. Old off the film TTL relied on light reflected off the film. Now Canon's old film era flash system called A-TTL would fire an IR pre-flash from a secondary flash tube or visible white flash from the main flash tube when in bounce mode except for the 540EZ (it switched back to TTL in bounce mode). With a half press of the shutter button. There was a sensor on the flash unit that would set exposure. When the flash actually fired for the exposure the cutoff system was in the camera body. This old system could easily be fooled or could be off if filters were attached to the lens. Since the sensor for A-TTL was in the speedlite itself and not in the camera like for off the film TTL or E-TTL. Even after E-TTL was released in 1995 Canon still made film bodies that supported all 3 flash metering systems in film bodies. Older EX series supported fall back to TTL for film bodies NOT COMPATIBLE with E-TTL. Later EX series speedlites starting with the 270EX (classic) dropped this and ALL EL series never supported it. The 600EX II-RT was the last high end speedlite to support fall back to TTL. Also the MT-26EX-RT macro ring lite released in 2017 completely dropped support for fall back to TTL. No EX series speedlites supported A-TTL instead the just supported off the film TTL. No digital camera supported the old A-TTL or TTL flash system. The last 2 film bodies Canon released dropped support for A-TTL & TTL. Then only supported E-TTL II only if used with an older flash set to A-TTL or TTL the flash will fire at full output only just like on a digital camera. This will cause gross overexposure and its never correct to set a flash to A-TTL or TTL those film bodies or digital cameras.

Re: Can an old DSLR learn new tricks?

zakslm — Mon, 30 Jun 2025 16:47:19 GMT

Demetrius,

I am in awe of your knowledge of the history and function of Canon speedlites! I remember how much my flash results improved when I got a Speedlite 155A to use on my AE-1 and some of the frustations from using the Vivitar 283 and learning to check the subject's reflectivity, etc. of the scene before shooting.

Since my both experience and your explanations prove once again that the camera and speedlite are far smarter than I am, I'll "trust the system" in that most of the time, it works for me. An example is a shot take earlier today using high speed sync as fill for a shot of this hummingbird at rest in a shade tree in the backyard. Not much thought involved, just had to remember to mount and turn on the flash!

Regards,

Re: Can an old DSLR learn new tricks?

deebatman316 — Mon, 30 Jun 2025 17:45:40 GMT

Flash photography is always improving. But most of not all improvements are on the camera body’s side. Not really the flash unless you’re talking about triggering off camera flashes. That’s a function of BOTH the speedlite and the camera body. The camera has to have the necessary hardware for it.