topic Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment in General Discussion

Horse Racing pics with new equipment

ilzho — Mon, 11 Jul 2016 21:30:13 GMT

Ok, so today was my second day with my new equipment. So much with 6+ lbs around my neck.

7D Mark II & 70-200mm f 2.8 L IS USM II.

Always learning, but I'm happy from where my ability was 2 months ago to where I am now.

I never thought I could get cool pictures like this.

2 months ago I was only a point and shoot guy in auto mode (that sounds funny) and never tried anything else with the functions.

Now with this stuff, it seems reasonably unlimited with what one can do.

Thanks!

https://flic.kr/s/aHskE1q3Bw

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

Waddizzle — Mon, 11 Jul 2016 22:37:05 GMT

I especially like photo about 1/3 of the way down the page numbered as 383A1409, "The Laughing Horse" I'm going to call it.

[EDIT} Whoops, spoke too soon. Page 2, the shots coming out of the gates. They're all great. Some are really great!

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

ilzho — Mon, 11 Jul 2016 22:51:27 GMT

That laughing horse has straighter teeth than I do, haha. Someone did a good job filing those down...

Thank you, for the kind words.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

Waddizzle — Mon, 11 Jul 2016 23:05:54 GMT

@ilzho wrote:
That laughing horse has straighter teeth than I do, haha. Someone did a good job filing those down...
Thank you, for the kind words.

You've earned the praise.

Now about that Canon camera strap around your neck. Some would suggest Black Rapid RS Sport Extreme.

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"Now with this stuff, it seems reasonably unlimited with what one can do."

Bingo! Kudos for that insight.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

ilzho — Mon, 11 Jul 2016 23:09:13 GMT

Yes, that strap, lol.

The one your talking abut I saw on a you tube video.

It looks really great.

I'll take recommendations.....

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

RobertTheFat — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 02:43:19 GMT

@ilzho wrote:
Yes, that strap, lol.
The one your talking abut I saw on a you tube video.
It looks really great.
I'll take recommendations.....

Out of curiosity ...

Were you able to establish a relationship with any of the professional photographers about whom you were concerned a couple of months ago? It appears that at least you haven't had any trouble getting good vantage points at the track.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

ilzho — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 10:19:24 GMT

Hi Bob:

I contacted the Director of Communications at the track and she said as long as I do not have a lens over 15" or a tripod and stay out of the patrons way, I can bring whatever camera equipment I want.

I have seen people with lens like mine and last week there was a big photo group that had massive lens (well over 15") and tripods and I'm sure were getting great pics.

I went up to a few that were using a tripod and told them I was just a patron, but I didn't want them to get in trouble or escorted out and mentioned that policy. They didn't care and were kinda 'standoffish', but I was just trying to help.

Anyway, the track is crowded around the finish line, but there is plenty of room around the rail before of after the finish line.

Sadly, this weekend are the last races of the thoroughbred season, 😞

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

RobertTheFat — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 12:03:52 GMT

@ilzho wrote:
Hi Bob:

I contacted the Director of Communications at the track and she said as long as I do not have a lens over 15" or a tripod and stay out of the patrons way, I can bring whatever camera equipment I want.

I have seen people with lens like mine and last week there was a big photo group that had massive lens (well over 15") and tripods and I'm sure were getting great pics.
I went up to a few that were using a tripod and told them I was just a patron, but I didn't want them to get in trouble or escorted out and mentioned that policy. They didn't care and were kinda 'standoffish', but I was just trying to help.

Sounds as though the rule is there to be trotted out and cited only if somebody makes a pest of himself by seriously trying to hog the space.

Anyway, the track is crowded around the finish line, but there is plenty of room around the rail before of after the finish line.

Sadly, this weekend are the last races of the thoroughbred season, 😞

So you move on to the next learning experience. Texas is a big state with much scenery and a lot going on. When is rodeo season? Your experience at the track might be somewhat transferrable to that sort of event.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

ilzho — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 12:16:52 GMT

It's funny you mention that.

Last week I was searching my area for hunter/jumping events, barrel racing and other equestrian event to go to.

I'll reach out to some of them to see what their camera restrictions are and stuff like that.

I also thought about contacting some horse stables and asking them if I could just come and take pictures and practice shooting.

Fun stuff to me.

Thanks,

David

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

TTMartin — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 15:02:35 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
You've earned the praise.

Now about that Canon camera strap around your neck. Some would suggest Black Rapid RS Sport Extreme.

I would suggest you look at the OP/Tech USA strap system (OP/TECH USA Utility Strap-Sling and System Connectors-Uni Adapter Loop).

It is less expensive than the Black Rapid Straps, but, is still high quality and made in the USA.

The biggest difference is the OP/Tech USA is designed to use the camera's existing strap mounting points. The Black Rapid straps use a screw in the tripod mount. I personally know of one person who had that screw come loose and have his camera fall to the ground. Luckly there was no damage. However, he is now constantly checking the tightness of the mounting screw. Doing what I call the Black Rapid Dance.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

Waddizzle — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 15:23:19 GMT

@TTMartin wrote:
@Waddizzle wrote:
You've earned the praise.

Now about that Canon camera strap around your neck. Some would suggest Black Rapid RS Sport Extreme.

I would suggest you look at the OP/Tech USA strap system (OP/TECH USA Utility Strap-Sling and System Connectors-Uni Adapter Loop).

It is less expensive than the Black Rapid Straps, but, is still high quality and made in the USA.

The biggest difference is the OP/Tech USA is designed to use the camera's existing strap mounting points. The Black Rapid straps use a screw in the tripod mount. I personally know of one person who had that screw come loose and have his camera fall to the ground. Luckly there was no damage. However, he is now constantly checking the tightness of the mounting screw. Doing what I call the Black Rapid Dance.

I've looked at those, too. I have complaints with both mounting styles.

Using the conventional strap mounting points doesn't always give you a good balance, particularly with a heavy lens. The heavy lens shouldn't be dangling from the camera's lens mount. If the lens has a tripod mount collar, then that is probably where it should be supported, to relieve the torque on the camera's mount.

The thought of screwing into the tripod mount of the camera doesn't give me a warm and fuzzy feeling. I have fears of it becoming loose. I know there are specfic instructions to tighten it up, though, so accidental drops could be user error. Being able to screw into the tripod collar of a big lens is an advantage. But, the tripod collars introduce another set of questions. Are they designed to support the weight of the lens like that? All of the weight and torque is in the opposite direction from when mounted on a tripod, as it was designed.

So, for now, I use a camera holster. It works equally well with my 70-200mm and 100-400mm lenses. I am not a "run and gun" photographer, so I don't need the camera always at the immediate ready. When I take shots, I'm usually in one place, and not jostling around. I like the protection of the holster against bumps and accidental drops, as well as the weight balance. PLUS, there's no hard, knobby, camera bumping off my hip for half the day. Besides, it is far less noticeable than a bare camera dangling from your neck, especially a full frame with a "big white" lens.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

TTMartin — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 16:16:27 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
@TTMartin wrote:
I would suggest you look at the OP/Tech USA strap system (OP/TECH USA Utility Strap-Sling and System Connectors-Uni Adapter Loop).

It is less expensive than the Black Rapid Straps, but, is still high quality and made in the USA.

The biggest difference is the OP/Tech USA is designed to use the camera's existing strap mounting points. The Black Rapid straps use a screw in the tripod mount. I personally know of one person who had that screw come loose and have his camera fall to the ground. Luckly there was no damage. However, he is now constantly checking the tightness of the mounting screw. Doing what I call the Black Rapid Dance.
I've looked at those, too. I have complaints with both mounting styles.

Using the conventional strap mounting points doesn't always give you a good balance, particularly with a heavy lens. The heavy lens shouldn't be dangling from the camera's lens mount. If the lens has a tripod mount collar, then that is probably where it should be supported, to relieve the torque on the camera's mount.

Lenses that are too heavy to hang off camera mount, they have their own strap mounting points.

See the strap mount on the tripod collar, below the adjustment knob on the EF 500mm f/4L IS II (7.0 lbs)? That is where you would attach the OP/Tech USA strap.

For my Sigma 120-300mm f/2.8 (5.7 lbs) I had one of the OP/Tech USA mounting points attached to the lens strap mount, and using the Utility Strap extension the other was attached to the camera's normal strap mounting point. This not only supported the lens by the strap, it also prevented either from falling in the event the camera and lens became disconnected. Also, a too common occurrence with the Black Rapid strap. Black Rapid sells add-ons to address this issue, but, it also further increases the cost.

Since Canon engineers didn't put a strap mount on the EF 70-200 f/2.8L IS II (3.2 lbs) or the EF 100-400 L IS II (3.0 lbs), I can only assume they feel the lens is not too heavy for the camera lens mount.

edit: keep in mind cameras like the 5D Mk III with battery grip, 7D Mk II with battery grip or 1DX Mk II are around 3 lbs themselves. So the camera hanging off lens, or 3 lb lens hanging off camera, there really isn't much difference.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

Waddizzle — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 16:20:58 GMT

"For my Sigma 120-300mm f/2.8 (5.7 lbs) I had one of the OP/Tech USA mounting points attached to the lens strap mount, and using the Utility Strap extension the other was attached to the camera's normal strap mounting point. This not only supported the lens by the strap, it also prevented either from falling in the event the camera and lens became disconnected. Also, a too common occurrence with the Black Rapid strap. Black Rapid sells add-ons to address this issue, but, it also further increases the cost.

Lens strap mounts. That's food for thought. But, I would not assume that the lack of a lens mount suggests that the lens is not too heavy for the camera lens mount, most particularly with the smaller Rebel camera bodies that are not reinforced with alloy frames. I have read cautions in this regard somewhere, but I cannot remember where.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

TTMartin — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 17:57:45 GMT

In this case we are talking about the OP with a 7D Mk II and a EF 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, not someone with a Rebel.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

Waddizzle — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 18:12:38 GMT

@TTMartin wrote:
In this case we are talking about the OP with a 7D Mk II and a EF 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, not someone with a Rebel.

"edit: keep in mind cameras like the 5D Mk III with battery grip, 7D Mk II with battery grip or 1DX Mk II are around 3 lbs themselves. So the camera hanging off lens, or 3 lb lens hanging off camera, there really isn't much difference."

Yup, which is exactly why I use a holster with my 6D w/grip, 1D Mk IV, or my son's 7D Mk II.

To be fair, though, the CoG, Center of Gravity, of the camera is not at as great of a distance from the center line of the mount compared to the CoG of a larger lens. The camera's weight does not present anywhere near as much torque on the mount when the lens is supporting the camera, compared to the amount of torque when the camera is supporting the lens.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

ilzho — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 23:45:58 GMT

Ok so you guys confused the hell out of me, hahaha

For my 7D mark II and 70-200mm lens....

I keep the camera in my hand or I use the Canon strap over my shoulder and the camera/lens pointing down towards me on my side.

My problem with the Canon strap is it's not long enough, IMO.

I do not need a smooth silky strap to quickly bring the camera up to shoot something.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

TTMartin — Tue, 12 Jul 2016 23:54:35 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
@TTMartin wrote:
In this case we are talking about the OP with a 7D Mk II and a EF 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, not someone with a Rebel.
edit: keep in mind cameras like the 5D Mk III with battery grip, 7D Mk II with battery grip or 1DX Mk II are around 3 lbs themselves. So the camera hanging off lens, or 3 lb lens hanging off camera, there really isn't much difference.
Yup, which is exactly why I use a holster with my 6D w/grip, 1D Mk IV, or my son's 7D Mk II.

To be fair, though, the CoG, Center of Gravity, of the camera is not at as great of a distance from the center line of the mount compared to the CoG of a larger lens. The camera's weight does not present anywhere near as much torque on the mount when the lens is supporting the camera, compared to the amount of torque when the camera is supporting the lens.

The difference in CG really doesn't come into play as far as stress on the lens mount when the camera is free to pivot on the strap mounting point. At that point the CG of both the camera and the lens combined aligns below the strap mounting point. It is only when you begin to lift the camera with your hand and provide an axial moment that the differences in CG comes into play.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

Waddizzle — Wed, 13 Jul 2016 01:15:46 GMT

@TTMartin wrote:
@Waddizzle wrote:
@TTMartin wrote:
In this case we are talking about the OP with a 7D Mk II and a EF 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, not someone with a Rebel.
edit: keep in mind cameras like the 5D Mk III with battery grip, 7D Mk II with battery grip or 1DX Mk II are around 3 lbs themselves. So the camera hanging off lens, or 3 lb lens hanging off camera, there really isn't much difference.
Yup, which is exactly why I use a holster with my 6D w/grip, 1D Mk IV, or my son's 7D Mk II.

To be fair, though, the CoG, Center of Gravity, of the camera is not at as great of a distance from the center line of the mount compared to the CoG of a larger lens. The camera's weight does not present anywhere near as much torque on the mount when the lens is supporting the camera, compared to the amount of torque when the camera is supporting the lens.
The difference in CG really doesn't come into play as far as stress on the lens mount when the camera is free to pivot on the strap mounting point. At that point the CG of both the camera and the lens combined aligns below the strap mounting point. It is only when you begin to lift the camera with your hand and provide an axial moment that the differences in CG comes into play.

Unfortunately, you're wrong.. Do a web search for " moment of inertia ". Math argues against you.

You treat your gear your way, and I will treat my gear my way. Peace.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

Waddizzle — Wed, 13 Jul 2016 01:28:18 GMT

@ilzho wrote:
Ok so you guys confused the hell out of me, hahaha

For my 7D mark II and 70-200mm lens....
I keep the camera in my hand or I use the Canon strap over my shoulder and the camera/lens pointing down towards me on my side.

My problem with the Canon strap is it's not long enough, IMO.

I do not need a smooth silky strap to quickly bring the camera up to shoot something.

Using the Canon strap over your shoulder [not across your body] is too risky for me. The Black Rapid straps have an extra strap that goes around the arm to keep it on your shoulder.

For what is worth, I use a Toploader Pro 75 AW II Holster Bag from Lowepro. I still have a Canon strap on the camera when I use it, and I want to change that out. It doesn't work for me, not at all. But, what to use? I'm leaning towards a Black Rapid RS-7 for its' length. I need a LONG strap, too, and the RS-7 has an extension option.

[EDIT] While you may feel that you do not need a strap to keep the camera at the immediate ready, it is highly advisable to use a strap as a safety against the KLUTZ who bumps into you and knocks your camera out of your hand.

Re: Horse Racing pics with new equipment

ebiggs1 — Wed, 13 Jul 2016 03:10:38 GMT

David,

"I do not need a smooth silky strap to quickly bring the camera up to shoot something"

For weddings I use a CPS shoulder strap which is available from Op/tech besides becoming a CPS member. I also use and like very much the Canon E2 hand strap.

But for sports, I guess horse racing is considered a spot, I would not use any strap at all. You said there were some pros there or at least pro looking guys? What were they using?

Although you got a long dissertation of useless info, most straps work very well for certain applications. You need to find the one that works for you. The Black Rapid Sport is a great choice. If it comes loose it is your fault not the straps! Attaching the strap to the lens is probably always going to be the best. Unless it is a medium or smaller tele or normal lens. Your 7D Mk II and ef 70-200mm f2.8L really needs to have the strap attached to the lens. Not the camera.

However, shooting sports, I would not use a strap at all.