topic Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera? in General Discussion

Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ScottyP — Sat, 08 Apr 2017 20:14:38 GMT

We will be going to Europe and I am probably going to take the DSLR and 2 or 3 lenses. I am also considering buying a small but good non-interchangeable lens camera. Something with a big-ish sensor and with a big aperture lens, though, not just a cheapo.

Since lens compatibility is not an issue, I am not limiting myself to Canons as I go to look into this possibility.

I am not particularly worried about the weight and bulk of the DSLR, more worried about theft, I think. Perhaps I should worry about the bulk, but I do want to get really high quality photos because I probably won't be going back any time soon so this is kind of a big deal.

Thoughts on lenses, backpacks and small cameras?

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

Waddizzle — Sat, 08 Apr 2017 21:01:27 GMT

What 2-3 lenses were you considering? Sounds like you want to be prepared for anything.

What sort of stuff do you expect to photograph? You cannot go wrong with a wide, or ultra-wide, angle lens.

The Powershot G Series seem to be pretty good, although P&S cameras are not for me. I think P&S cameras are expensive disposables. If I ever buy another one, it will be an inexpensive one.

I have two setups I use so that I don't look like Joe the Pro Photographer. I use my T5 with a Rokinon 14mm, although the EF-S 18-55mm STM has come out since I bought that combo. The fully manual lens gives me long battery life. My second small setup is an EOS M3 with an adapter and a pancake lens.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ScottyP — Sun, 09 Apr 2017 06:01:11 GMT

I was thinking of taking the 6d with the 35 Art and the 70-200. Maybe take the 24-105L for daytime trips.

I look at the Fuji and Sony and Canon top end point and shoots, some of which have APS-c sensors and think...hmmmmm....

Really though, I am probably going to go ahead and carry the DSLR and lenses.

Trip is Switzerland, Italy, France and Spain. Subjects will as always be mostly my 3 girls but with the expensive scenery ad a backdrop.

Im in a dangerous spending mood, having just pressed the BUY button in the airfare and hotels. Perhaps I should not be trusted with lens decisions now, but for purposes of this trip,do I need a wide angle lens? Should I take a tripod for low light instead?

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

RobertTheFat — Sun, 09 Apr 2017 11:57:12 GMT

@ScottyP wrote:
I was thinking of taking the 6d with the 35 Art and the 70-200. Maybe take the 24-105L for daytime trips.

I look at the Fuji and Sony and Canon top end point and shoots, some of which have APS-c sensors and think...hmmmmm....

Really though, I am probably going to go ahead and carry the DSLR and lenses.

Trip is Switzerland, Italy, France and Spain. Subjects will as always be mostly my 3 girls but with the expensive scenery ad a backdrop.

Im in a dangerous spending mood, having just pressed the BUY button in the airfare and hotels. Perhaps I should not be trusted with lens decisions now, but for purposes of this trip,do I need a wide angle lens? Should I take a tripod for low light instead?

I don't see what the 35 Art does for you if you have the 24-105. I'd bring a 16-35 instead. If you have to buy it, the price is more or less roundoff error in a trip that takes four or five people through four countries.

Many tourist venues are hostile to tripods; and if you're in a group tour, you might rarely have time to set it up. I'd leave it at home.

In your shoes, the only "top end point and shoot" I'd consider is the new Canon mirrorless with the built-in viewfinder. But really, I think I'd stick to DSLRs.

I'm well past the point at which air travel is virtually impossible because of the camera equipment I insist on bringing along. Keep that in mind if you're tempted to take any of my advice.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

Waddizzle — Sun, 09 Apr 2017 14:06:10 GMT

I agree with Bob about the 35mm lens. The standard range zoom 24-105 should be sufficient, not unless you want the wide aperture. I would take one or the other, but not both.

I'm a ultra-wide angle lens nutjob, so when I tell you that 24-35mm isn't wide, then take it with a grain of salt. I love my EF 16-35mm f/2.8L II USM. I always have it mounted when I'm sightseeing and do not know what to expect. I think Bob's suggestion on the lens is a good one. I'd never disagree with carrying that lens, anyway.

The shot below was taken at 16-35mm with a 1D Mark IV.

The 70-200 is a big, heavy beast when it comes to air travel. I rarely fly, but I left it at home during the one domestic trip I took since I bought it. I took my 16-35 f/2.8L, 50mm f/1.8, 100 f/2.8L Macro. If I had a flash, I would have brought that and left the macro behind, because I expected most of my shots would be taken indoors at private homes. I now have a flash for the 6D.

As it turned out, I used the 50mm for nearly all of my indoor shots of family and friends. I used the 16-35mm for all of my outdoor shots as i was sightseeing. Never did use the 100mm macro, even though I could have for a couple of indoor closeups. The 50mm was just fine for closeups indoors, and the 16-35mm worked well for taking in the entire rooms.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

jrhoffman75 — Mon, 10 Apr 2017 11:55:50 GMT

I've been to Europe several times. For the places I went a tele zoom was not needed. Like wadizzle said, wide is more useful..

Inside churches, narrow streets and the like were the main venues I was at. 16-35 and 24-105 would be a good two lens set for that trip based on my experience.

A monopod for steadying inside buildings would be helpful - forget a tripod.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ebiggs1 — Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:11:03 GMT

Usually two 1 series cameras go with me everywhere I go. I have a basic bag with the ef 16-35mm f2.8L, ef 24-70mm f2.8L and ef 70-200mm f2.8L. My extended bag for warranted use adds and includes the ef 8-15mm f4L and Sigma 150-600mm f5-6.3 Sport.

If I headed for Europe tomorrow this gear would be going with me. I have a shoot in Lawence, Kansas on Thursday and this gear will be going with me.

However, on-the-other-hand I do have and rely on a G1x. This and the newer G1x II are great little, not so little, cameras. They are capable of very nice shots. It goes with me, too.

I love some of my unique primes but for a journey like Europe, they are too specialized if you do not know exactly what you will be shooting. One example would be the ef 400mm f5.6L. Fantastic lens, has no peer. Another is my ef 50mm f1.2L but not for Europe unless I know of a particular shot I want to get.

BTW, the G1x II may not be the best P&S on the market today but it is the best Canon P&S. G1x Mk II

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ebiggs1 — Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:15:29 GMT

Scotty,

"I was thinking of taking the 6d with the 35 Art ..."

Don't let anybody kid you the Siggt 35mil Art is a seriously sharp lens. It might just be the sharpest lens made. If you want great IQ, take it. It and the 50mil Art are in another class of high IQ lenses.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ScottyP — Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:19:46 GMT

@ebiggs1 wrote:
Scotty,
"I was thinking of taking the 6d with the 35 Art ..."

Don't let anybody kid you the Siggt 35mil Art is a seriously sharp lens. It might just be the sharpest lens made. If you want great IQ, take it. It and the 50mil Art are in another class of high IQ lenses.

I sure love mine. So sharp and it can practically see in the dark. Seems like there may be some dim indoor shots to grab over there.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ebiggs1 — Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:25:07 GMT

People that have never owned one have no idea. Probably should hold their comments!

I take a lot of heavy gear where ever I go but I also take a P&S. Currently I have a G1X but there is a newer verison. These are very capable cameras and they work where a full size DSLR won't. I used to use a G15. I still have it. But check out the G1x Mk II

It isn't the best P&S on the market but it is Canon's best.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ebiggs1 — Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:29:52 GMT

BTW, two things I would NOT take are flashes and a tripod. Not even a monopod.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ebiggs1 — Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:33:27 GMT

"Canon 6D, EF 70-200mm L f/2.8 IS mk2; Sigma 35mm f/1.4 "Art" EF 100mm f/2.8L Macro; EF 85mm f/1.8; EF 1.4x extender mk. 3; EF 24-105 f/4 L; EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS; 3x Phottix Mitros+ speedlites"

What camera do you use that lens on? It is the only lens you have I would consider taking. Unless you want to use your 6D, than the ef 24-105mm F4L and the Siggy Art.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

Waddizzle — Tue, 11 Apr 2017 09:24:56 GMT

John makes a good point. Many of the best sights in Europe are small, tight, or narrow spaces. When you encounter places that are not, they're usually grand vistas that are begging for a super wide angle lens.

The 35mm Art and your 24-105 does sound like a good pair. You may be better off buying an ultra-wide lens, instead of a point and shoot. Remember, I think point and shoots are expensive disposables. Although, a high quality point and shoot just might be what's best, because of their small size and weight..

Your biggest problem just may be charging you're camera batteries, though. Take a couple of spare memory cards, too.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

RobertTheFat — Tue, 11 Apr 2017 12:49:06 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
John makes a good point. Many of the best sights in Europe are small, tight, or narrow spaces. When you encounter places that are not, they're usually grand vistas that are begging for a super wide angle lens.

The 35mm Art and your 24-105 does sound like a good pair. You may be better off buying an ultra-wide lens, instead of a point and shoot. Remember, I think point and shoots are expensive disposables. Although, a high quality point and shoot just might be what's best, because of their small size and weight..

Your biggest problem just may be charging you're camera batteries, though. Take a couple of spare memory cards, too.

I don't see a problem charging the camera batteries. Most (all?) Canon chargers work on both 110VAC and 220VAC and both 50 and 60 Hz. What you will need, though, is one or more adapters, because the wall outlets in Europe are incompatible with their US or British counterparts. You may also want to take a short extension cord, because a charger that plugs directly into the wall could be hard to use, even with an adapter.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ebiggs1 — Tue, 11 Apr 2017 12:55:54 GMT

"I think point and shoots are expensive disposables"

You may think so but you are far from correct. Some of the top rated P&S are capable of outstanding results. Canon lages behind this market just like it does in mirrorless cameras. The Fujifilm X100F being one of several. The Sony DSC-RX1/B if you have the coin. More reasonable priced Panasonic LUMIX DMC-LX10K is very good.

Since you have never used one it isn't a good idea the bash the whole format. The Powershot G1x Mk II does a great job. I got to try a Canon PowerShot G7 X Mark II the other day and it is fantastic at less than $700 bucks.

One problem you have with most P&S cameras is you can't get a real WA lens. But that seems to be what folks seem to think Scotty needs. Not so with the high end models, however.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ScottyP — Thu, 13 Apr 2017 10:22:14 GMT

I have no crop camera anymore so the 17-55 is a paperweight. I should probably sell it. I had thought about getting a 7d2 or an 80d as a sports camera/second camera but my girls have not developed much interest in sports. I may grab a 6d2 when they come out instead, or possibly a 5d4.

I hate to go anywhere without one bright prime so I am having a hard time leaving the 35mm home.

I also was having an issue with leaving the 70-200 but mostly just because I love it. I am warming to the idea though because it is big and heavy and possibly a longer FL than I'll need.

I never really fell in love with the 24-105 but it probably does make sense for the trip.

I have never shot WA before and I am wondering if I should consider buying the 16-35 III.

I wish I lived near NYC or somewhere with a camera shop so I could try out camera backpacks. It is hard to really evaluate fit and size on the internet.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ebiggs1 — Sat, 15 Apr 2017 13:31:31 GMT

"I am having a hard time leaving the 35mm home."

Then don't. No matter what this is an outstanding lens. It makes a wonderful 'normal' lens, too. Matter of fact the 35mil and the 70-200mm are a pretty good combo start. Just a more WA and you are set.

"Canon 6D, EF 70-200mm L f/2.8 IS mk2; Sigma 35mm f/1.4 "Art", not too shabby in my book. You like the Siggy so have you considered the 20mm F1.4 DG HSM A ? You will like it just as much. A WA zoom I have come to really like is my Tokina AT-X 16-28mm f/2.8 Pro FX Lens. It is only $550 and preforms like $1550. I really, really like that Tok. It is amazing.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

Waddizzle — Sat, 15 Apr 2017 11:43:37 GMT

The choice of a camera bag is as personal as selecting a pair of comfortable shoes.

My preference in DSLR camera has been evolving, probably because my camera kit has also been evolving. Back in the film days, I carried the classic camera shoulder bag with a body and 2 lenses, flash, and stuff. It was a little awkward to use, because I always needed a table or a some other clean place to put it down, so i could open it. But, that is what we had to work with back then.

Fast forward 30 years, and my old shoulder bag was too small for my DSLR and 3 lenses, and stuff. I bought a camera backpack, with all of the dividers. I bought another backpack when my lens arsenal grew to 5 lenses. Bought another backpack when I bought a second camera body. Discovered that you need really big backpacks to hold a professional size body upright. So, I bought one of those, too. The big kit weighs a ton fully loaded. It stays in the car, or at home.

It didn't take me long to realize that backpacks don't work very well on a hot summer day, either. You wind up carrying it as a sling, over one shoulder, which forces me to lean a little bit as I walk. Not very comfortable, and it meant one hand was always holding the strap secured to my shoulder, which defeated the purpose of carrying a backpack. Both hands were not free..

My backpacks had gotten to be too big for everyday toting, anyway. I wanted something to carry a pro size body, or a camera w/grip, with a 70-200 f/2.8 lens mounted to it. That's when I discovered a holster. I can go hands-free, because the holster can sling across my chest.

I've been carrying a holster for over 18 months. It's perfect for safely carrying a camera, with a mounted lens. It doesn't shout Joe the Professional Photographer, either. When I want to carry extra stuff, I use a messenger style bag, which I can carry on my shoulder or slung across my chest. I've found a messenger bag is more comfortable on the shoulder than a backpack, AND I can reach inside of it without having to put it down, or take it off my shoulder.

Because the messenger bag is on my shoulder, and not on my back like a backpack, it is more secure. I have less worry when I am in a crowd about someone opening a zipper on my backpack. The messenger has fewer exposed zippers, and the main compartment is protected b a big flap.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

ScottyP — Sat, 15 Apr 2017 13:25:33 GMT

I have been looking at holsters (Cotton Carrier, etc.) for around my normal stomping grounds. The readings and my one prior personal experience in Barcelona pickpockets dictates that would not work on this trip though.

The messenger bag added to the holster sounds like a good combo.

Re: Europe trip; bring DSLR or buy small camera?

jrhoffman75 — Sat, 15 Apr 2017 13:30:03 GMT

I use the smallest cableclik (black one) to fasten zipper pulls together for security.

Barcelona pickpockets are amazing what they can do and how fast.

http://www.cableclamp.com/product-category/cable-clic/