topic 90d too dark in HDR in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 22:55:43 GMT

I’m really having issues with the 90d In-camera HDR. My subject is an interior room in afternoon light with large windows for natural light. Using a manual lens, I’m setting up for AV assuming if I set the ISO to 100 and the f-stop to 8, I’ll only need to be concerned with shutter speed. Using spot metering, I note that the dark is coming in at 0”8 and the bright is at 1/5, I’ve set up for both 3 and 5-shots at +-2ev and the resulting hdr image in both shots come out well-exposed for the highlights but too dark in the remaining areas. Am I doing something wrong or is the hdr function known for this?

Sent from my iPad

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Waddizzle — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:20:28 GMT

Why are you using Spot Metering mode? I would think Evaluative Metering would work better.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:23:37 GMT

I was spotting to see what the recommended ss readings were in the dark areas and the light ones to see what the camera was calculating in its choices of automatically setting the bracketed shots.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:24:52 GMT

My understanding is the in Av mode, the aperture and iso are set and the camera chooses what it thinks the ss should be

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Waddizzle — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:26:26 GMT

The camera does not automatically set the bracketed shots. You do.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:28:07 GMT

Yes, I tell it I want x-number of shots x-Evs apart.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Waddizzle — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:28:20 GMT

@Jlames wrote:
My understanding is the in Av mode, the aperture and iso are set and the camera chooses what it thinks the ss should be

The camera will set +/- 1 Ev, or whatever bracketing you set up. It is based on the initial "normal" exposure.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:28:36 GMT

But it chooses the ss or am I missing something?

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Waddizzle — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:32:55 GMT

@Jlames wrote:
But it chooses the ss or am I missing something?

The camera does not "choose the shutter speeds." They are calculated from the initial exposure.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Waddizzle — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:34:31 GMT

I am willing to bet that the "spot" that you used to meter the scene came out perfectly in the HDR composite.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:35:12 GMT

Ok thank you

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Sun, 28 Feb 2021 23:54:07 GMT

Yes it did. I probably just don't understand the whole thing.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

jrhoffman75 — Mon, 01 Mar 2021 14:55:04 GMT

@Jlames wrote:
I’m really having issues with the 90d In-camera HDR. My subject is an interior room in afternoon light with large windows for natural light. Using a manual lens, I’m setting up for AV assuming if I set the ISO to 100 and the f-stop to 8, I’ll only need to be concerned with shutter speed. Using spot metering, I note that the dark is coming in at 0”8 and the bright is at 1/5, I’ve set up for both 3 and 5-shots at +-2ev and the resulting hdr image in both shots come out well-exposed for the highlights but too dark in the remaining areas. Am I doing something wrong or is the hdr function known for this?

Sent from my iPad

Try this approach.

1. set your camera to M mode using the aperture and ISO you want.

2. spot meter off the brightest region you care about; note shutter speed for correct exposure.

3. do the same for the darkest region you care about.

4. select an initial shutter speed about midway between the two.

5. set your AEB bracketing and number so tthat the bracket range exceeds the two shutter speeds you recorded.

Combine the images in your editing software.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Tue, 02 Mar 2021 03:48:22 GMT

Thank you, John. I'll try that tomorrow before I take it in to have it checked. Fortunately I've got a camera store here in LA (I know; brick & mortar) that is used to checking 90Ds as they've gotten a lot of complaints and yes; I've dealt with the old guy for years and he's honest.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Waddizzle — Tue, 02 Mar 2021 05:30:13 GMT

@Jlames wrote:
Thank you, John. I'll try that tomorrow before I take it in to have it checked. Fortunately I've got a camera store here in LA (I know; brick & mortar) that is used to checking 90Ds as they've gotten a lot of complaints and yes; I've dealt with the old guy for years and he's honest.

In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with your camera. Your problem is simple to fix Stop use Spot Metering for HDR, and use Evaluative Metering..

Stop for a moment and consider how Spot Metering works, and why people use it. Spot Metering takes a measurement on a very small area of the entire scene, and IGNORES everything else in the scene. You have said that the area where you are metering is coming properly, which is too be expected.

Your complaint is that the rest of the scene is not coming out properly. You are complaining about the parts of the scene that Spot Metering completely ignores when it takes a measurement. The fix is to allow the camera to measure the entire scene, instead of just one small bit of it.

If you switch to Evaluative Metering, the camera will evaluate the entire scene within the angle of view.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Tue, 02 Mar 2021 05:51:31 GMT

Ok, that makes sense but please understand; I'm really a newbie at this but not an idiot. I'm trying to understand how things work and following the "YouTube experts", I'm doing exactly what they say. Spot-metering came from https://youtu.be/Mp6jvdGwC8A but the question I'm still having an issue with is, if I set the aperture and the iso at fixed numbers and the only variable for the camera to calculate, how does it know where to start if I don't tell it what the "ideal", ambient shutter speed should be? And please, bear with me while I try and work through this. I appreciate your patience but, as I said, I'm well-educated biut that's sometimes a barrier. Knowing the answer has never mattered because if I can't understand how the answer got to be the answer, I'm still stuck.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Waddizzle — Tue, 02 Mar 2021 06:19:08 GMT

@Jlames wrote:
Ok, that makes sense but please understand; I'm really a newbie at this but not an idiot. I'm trying to understand how things work and following the "YouTube experts", I'm doing exactly what they say. Spot-metering came from https://youtu.be/Mp6jvdGwC8A

but the question I'm still having an issue with is, if I set the aperture and the iso at fixed numbers and the only variable for the camera to calculate, how does it know where to start if I don't tell it what the "ideal", ambient shutter speed should be? And please, bear with me while I try and work through this. I appreciate your patience but, as I said, I'm well-educated biut that's sometimes a barrier. Knowing the answer has never mattered because if I can't understand how the answer got to be the answer, I'm still stuck.

The full User Manual is a better way to spend your time than YouTube. YouTube is a great resource, but many of the channels are produced by people who do not fully understand the gear or the material. Some channels are better than others. Just keep in mind the best resource available to your is the full User Manual, which can be downloaded for free from Canon Support.

The User Manual shows you how much of each scene is measured in each Metering Mode.

How does it know where to start? The camera's metering system figures it out. The camera meters the scene according to the metering mode you have selected. It uses the measurement to come up with a shutter speed for a standard 0 Ev exposure.

Notice Item #31 in the below screenshot of the Optical Viewfinder display..

The is the Exposure Value, Ev scale. It displays a value between -3 Ev to 3 Ev, with the center being a normal exposure. This meter is telling you how much under or over exposed you are.

When you use HDR mode, you should see little tick marks on the scale that show you the exposures that will be captured.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Waddizzle — Tue, 02 Mar 2021 06:35:02 GMT

@Jlames wrote:
Ok, that makes sense but please understand; I'm really a newbie at this but not an idiot. I'm trying to understand how things work and following the "YouTube experts", I'm doing exactly what they say. Spot-metering came from https://youtu.be/Mp6jvdGwC8A but the question I'm still having an issue with is, if I set the aperture and the iso at fixed numbers and the only variable for the camera to calculate, how does it know where to start if I don't tell it what the "ideal", ambient shutter speed should be? And please, bear with me while I try and work through this. I appreciate your patience but, as I said, I'm well-educated biut that's sometimes a barrier. Knowing the answer has never mattered because if I can't understand how the answer got to be the answer, I'm still stuck.

There is a major difference between what you are doing and what is shown in the video. A good understanding of the "Exposure Triangle" would help you to better understand the video.

The video shows two approaches to capturing the exposures. One approach uses AEB, Automatic Expousre Bracketing, which he calls "semi-automatic". The second approach he calls "manual", where he manually sets each exposure. Both of these approaches capture the images, which are later processed in a computer.

You are using what is best described as a "fully automatic" HDR mode, where the images are processed in the camera. Doing so gives you far less control over the process of capturing the various exposures.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Jlames — Tue, 02 Mar 2021 09:01:16 GMT

And yes, I understand that. I'm working on a better, working understanding of the triangle and thus my ability. I simply thought the camera would be capable of doing a better job at least close to what's advertised. To me, what the camera produces, unless I'm doing something horribly wrong, is unusable. So, I'll simply, keep working on my manual technique from the basics up with help from people like you. Thank you again.

Re: 90d too dark in HDR

Waddizzle — Tue, 02 Mar 2021 14:16:51 GMT

@Jlames wrote:
And yes, I understand that. I'm working on a better, working understanding of the triangle and thus my ability. I simply thought the camera would be capable of doing a better job at least close to what's advertised. To me, what the camera produces, unless I'm doing something horribly wrong, is unusable. So, I'll simply, keep working on my manual technique from the basics up with help from people like you. Thank you again.

I think I figured out what is confusing you. He is not using Spot Metering for automatic exposures. He sets the camera to M mode, and dials in his own exposure. He is not using automatic exposure, so metering mode is irrelevant.

He uses Spot Metering because he is using the camera as if it were a light meter. That's the only reason he uses Spot Meteriing mode. He is measuring ambient light.