topic Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

CraigRoberts — Tue, 08 Dec 2015 09:41:20 GMT

I'm a pro landscape photographer and have a YouTube Channel showing videos that I do in and around the UK offering tips and technique advice. Some of the videos online show me revealing the benefits of the Canon 24TSE lens and more importantly how to use it! Here is the link to one of those videos, shot on the Yorkshire coast in the UK. I hope its proves useful for anyone interested in purchasing one of these lenses. https://youtu.be/V4Ss2BMBU6M

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

RobertTheFat — Tue, 08 Dec 2015 12:16:35 GMT

That is a very strange URL, which appears (from Googling it) to have nothing to do with YouTube. I'd be extremely wary of clicking on it.

MODERATORS TAKE NOTE!!

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

CraigRoberts — Tue, 08 Dec 2015 12:31:16 GMT

Hi RobertTheFat

I can assure you that is a genuine link to my YouTube video. That link came from selecting the Share option.

The address bar link is below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4Ss2BMBU6M&feature=youtu.be

If you would like to verify the link yourself, please search the video title and check the Share link matches:

'Photographing seascapes & long exposures at the Yorkshire coast'

Of course, I apoligise if it gave you any concern.

Craig

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

jrhoffman75 — Tue, 08 Dec 2015 12:43:00 GMT

Link is fine.

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

ebiggs1 — Wed, 09 Dec 2015 07:50:05 GMT

Craig,

It is a nice video but is it a tutorial or what photos you like to shoot?

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

TCampbell — Wed, 09 Dec 2015 15:23:42 GMT

As others have pointed out -- the link is genuine. A number of sites now use these "short" URLs which are easier to share.

However... because cautious when encountering something unexpected is certainly wise. When in doubt, if you use the "Firefox" web browser (I normally do not, but I keep it on my computer specifically so I can do the following) you can get an "Add-on" called "NoScript".

Go to the Firefox "Tools" pull-down menu and select "Add-ons" then click "Get Add-Ons" and search for an add-on named "NoScript". NoScript disables Javascript in the browser on a website-by-website basis (so it can be enabled for sites you trust, and disabled for sites you don't trust (and by default it doesn't trust anything until you tell it to trust it.)) NoScript also watches for a number of other malicious attacks that websites will use and blocks them too.

With this enabled, you can test a website knowing that it wont be able to launch anything on your computer and when you determine that the website is ok, you can tell it to enable scripting on that site.

Craig, VERY nice video and thanks for sharing your tips on tilt-shift, long exposures, and panoramas.

I also own the TS-E 24mm f/3.5L II and confess that learning to adjust tilt angle to the plane of intended focus took a while to learn.

There is a math formula for determine the tilt-angle based on knowing the distance of the lens axis to the surface where you want the plane of focus. (tilt angle in degrees = arcsine(focal-length of the lens) / distance from the lens axis to the intended plane of focus (and that's in millimeters since the lens focal length is in millimeters)). I can't see photographers using rulers and calculators to work out the angle but if you toy with the formula you come to the realization that the closer the lens is to the intended plane of focus then the greater the tilt-angle needs to be. The higher the camera is above the plane of focus, the less the tilt-angle will need to be (which, to me, became a bit of a confirmation when I'd adjust the camera that I was at least "in the ballpark.")

If doing tethered shooting, there's a program named Kuuvik Capture which has some nice features for tilt-shift lenses... one is multi-point focus aid and the other is focus peaking. Basically you frame up the shot and click the points in the shot that need to be in sharp focus. Those points that you clicked will give you large windows showing magnified detail of those areas (in the same way that you used 10x live-view to focus the cliffs in the background and then had to move the 10x bounding box down to the rock in the foreground to achieve focus... their "multi-point" control lets you see both 10x boxes on the computer screen at the same time (so that's nice)). The "focus peaking" causes the areas of maximum focus to twinkle (the sharp edges get a sort of animated static/snow appearence so you can be sure the computer believes you've achieved focus if you don't trust your eyes.)

Kuuvik Capture only runs on a computer so it's only going to work for tethered shooting (probably not what you want for landscapes... but if you use your lens in a studio stituation then it's great.)

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

BenElliott — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 09:03:20 GMT

There are a lot of videos around discussing TS-E lenses. What is shift/Tilt; "miniture" effect. But, no one seems remotely bothered with the landscaper's most pressing need and that is to get front to back sharpness. It's mentioned as an afterthought as if this is one of the lens' capabilities but no one seems remotely interested in showing where in the frame to focus before using Tilt.

Do I, for example, focus on the distant hills and then use tilt, or vice versa?

It's very frustrating trying to get an answer.

I'm using Canon's 24 TS-E by the way.

Ben

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

jrhoffman75 — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 10:59:39 GMT

https://www.australianlight.com.au/blog/post/using_lens_tilt_for_landscape_photography/

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

BenElliott — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 11:38:57 GMT

Thanks, John for the link. but, my gripe still persists.

The link demonstrated the fact that front to back sharpness is possible and the principle behing it. The link also had some nice shots showing tjhe results. But, there was nothing in the article to explicitly say where the focus was made before tilting the lens.

Everyone seems to assume we know and we don't all know.

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

kvbarkley — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 12:58:57 GMT

The Canon DLC has a bunch of articles, I did not go through them all to see if it answers your gripe. 8^)

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

BenElliott — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 13:25:23 GMT

Thanks. I'm not "having a go" at anyone in particular. It just seems that there are a lot of assumptions made and when we are new to a piece of technology, trying to get accurate information for one particular aspect of that technology is very hard to achieve.

I'll keep looking

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

TCampbell — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 15:22:50 GMT

Not a video, but here's an article that may be helpful: https://luminous-landscape.com/focusing-tilt-shift-lenses/

I have yet to find a decent video. I generally find (a) the "miniature" effect, or (b) someone who explains how to maximize the focus but explains the concept while not providing the steps to follow to achieve the results.

When I noticed the the index marks on the tilt-angle and verified that those marks are, in fact, degrees of tilt, I realized their *must* be a reason that the lens makers mark the degrees ... so I went in search of a formula. That was a less-straight-forward search than I would have expected. Originally I found articles that just hinted around at it. I ultimately found enough info that I was able to derive the formula and then did a bit of testing to make sure it worked. I eventually did find articles that gave the formula and confirmed that I what I found was correct.

So this article linked above is actually pretty good. It does give the formula. It also offers some practical advice where you don't use the formula. It could be improved with a diagram.

At the bottom of the article, the author has a list for a few lenses... 24mm, 45mm, 90mm, and 150mm (Canon's lenses are actually 17mm, 24mm, 45mm, 50mm, 90mm, and 135mm.

Anyway... the correct tilt-angle is based on knowing the focal length of the lens (that's easy to know ... it's either 17, 24, 45, 50, 90, or 135) and also the distance from the lens axis to the desired plane of focus. And since the units need to be the same and the lens is in millimeters, the distance from the lens axis to the focal plane *also* needs to be in millimeters.

The average human is 1.8 meters tall. If you were taking a photo of landscape while holding the camera at eye-level... it's *probably* about 1.7 meters from your eyes to the ground.

The tilt formula is: arcsine(tilt-angle) = lens-focal-length ÷ distance from lens-axis to desired focal plane

If the lens a 90mm tilt shift and the distance from the lens axis to the ground is 1.7 meters (1.7 meters = 1700mm)

Then it's: arcsine(tilt-angle) = 90 ÷ 1700

Your mobile phone probably has a calculator on it that can do sine / arc-sine. Divide 90 by 1700 and take the arcsine of the result. It turns out it works out to 3.03° (3° is close enough).

So right away, you should be able to put the tilt-angle to 3° down, place the camera on a tripod, and just focus and everything should come to focus.

The idea behind having a lookup table for your lenses and common heights you might use (eye-height, waist-height, knee-height, etc.) is that if you do this a lot, you start to just know about how much tilt to dial in based on how you want to set up the shot.

If you don't have a lookup table... I have seen people explain that you should focus on a near subject and tilt until the far subject is also in sharp focus. I've also seen the opposite... focus on the far object and adjust tilt until the near object is in focus. The "problem" with both of these... is that the NEXT step is always go back and double-check the original focus point to see if it is still in focus... followed by advice to adjust the tilt-angle ... or tilt the whole camera ... or re-tweak the focus...

When I read this I translate it to mean "just fiddle with stuff until it works".

I recognize that you *can* get focus across the entire field by using either technique and fiddling with controls until you get the result you want. But using a quick-lookup table or the math will quickly get you to the correct angle and now it's just a matter of focus (you should not have to re-tweak the angle).

Two generalizations... (1) the closer the camera is to the desired plane of focus, the more tilt it will require, and (2) the higher the focal length of the lens, the more tilt it will require.

If you were using a 24mm tilt-shift, then the amount of tilt needed if the camea is on a tripod at eye-level to shoot a flat field (the ground beneath your feet) is just fractionally less than 1° (remember that the 90mm needed about 3°). But if that same 24mm lens was at knee-level (say 500mm above the ground) ... now it's a 2.75° tilt. (divide 24 by 500 and take the arcsine of the result).

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

BenElliott — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 15:56:51 GMT

Nice bit of Maths, Tim.

Now, don't get me wrong, I can follow the maths but when I'm out in the field, that is the last thing I need to be thinking about.

I'm a simple guy. I need a simple way of getting that front to back sharpness. Fore example, I struggle with hyperfocal focussing on an "ordinary" lens. If the chart says focus on 45feet, my problem in the field is "where is 45 feet from the lens"?

This is why I am looking for a quick and simple method of getting the job done rather than getting a calculator out or getting a chart out.

Why does it have to be quick and simple? I have my wife telling me from behind "haven't you taken that picture yet". I know, we've all had that experience. So, quick focus on subject, jiggle the tilt knob, take picture. But where do I focus. This is what nobody is telling me.

Ben

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

kvbarkley — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 16:08:01 GMT

I never thought of a Tilt-shift lens as something to use quickly.

Anyway, to answer the "What is 45 feet?" question, in amazon search "laser rangefinder for golf".

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

BenElliott — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 16:36:23 GMT

And still nobody has answered my initial question.

Where in the frame/scene do I focus, whether it's quick or not.

I'm sorry. but, my frustration is getting the better of me.

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

kvbarkley — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 16:43:27 GMT

Remember, we are just users like you. You are talking about a small fraction of a small fraction of users. Most people probably focus again after the T/S adjustment.

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

TCampbell — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 18:03:05 GMT

There is another article ... this one is my favorite as it also includes interactive examples. I tried to find this earlier but their website was unreachable.

Here’s the link: https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/tilt-shift-lenses2.htm

They have different articles for using shift... the article above specifically deals with tilt ... including instructions on how to do this in the field.

Be aware that using tilt has a bit of a learning curve. Don’t expect to be able to do this in a hurry at first. As you do it more often, you start to get a bit more comfortable at knowing about how much tilt will be needed for a given situation. It is generally NOT a type of photography you do when rushed.

This is why I suggested calculating the tilt amounts for common camera heights such as the height of your eyes, your waist, your knees, etc.

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

BenElliott — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 19:12:51 GMT

Please, gents, don't get me wrong. I am very grateful for your input. I realise that we are all in this together. I realise too that it is a steep learning curve and, maybe I am in the minority on this. I just like taking landscape photos and it seemed such a simple question.

As I said in an earlier post, when using an "ordinary" lens my comment about not being sure where the hyperfocal point of focus was located (my example was 45feet) I should have then said that the quick reference about 1/3rd of the way in from the bottom of the frame using the grid in live-view is the way to estimate that hyperfocal point and I was wondering if there is a quick ready-reckoner for tilt.

I realise that very few shooters will own a TS lens but everyone in videos seems to concentrate on the shifting of the focal plane but hardly ever mentions where the focus point should be.

Tim: I will look at the link you have kindly found for me and again, I am very grateful for all your comments.

Ben

Re: Tilt Shift Lens Tutorial Videos

Waddizzle — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 01:19:12 GMT

First, I adjust the “bellows”, and then I adjust for critical focus. Adjusting focus, and then adjusting the tilt-shift without refocusing will almost always result in an OOF photograph.

The T-S lens alters the distance between the lens elements and the image sensor slightly. If you focus when the lens is “normal”, then why should it still be in focus after you have introduced tilt and/or shift?