topic Re: Looking for some advice in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

Looking for some advice

KAB — Thu, 12 Sep 2013 23:28:09 GMT

I hope I'm asking this in the correct place. I currently have a canon point and shoot, Powershot SX1 IS, and while it is a nice camera, it's still a point and shoot and I'm ready to upgrade to a SLR. I'm not looking to do anything real professional, I have a toddler and another baby on the way, and I'd like something nice enough that I can get some really good pictures of my little ones, since I don't ever pay for professional photo's. My todder is very active, and all of the pictures I currently take turn out blurry, the camera takes too long to snap the photo. I also need something that will be good with indoor low light. My budget is $1000, I know that's not much in the camera world, but that's all I can afford right now.

I have my eyes on the Rebel T3i or the T5i, I have no clue which one I need, if even one of those. I don't plan on using the auto feature, I want something that I can learn and grow with, but again, nothing real professional as I will just be using it on my girls, but I still want something nice. As far as lenses go? I was thinking to start with the lens that comes with the camera, the 18-55mm, and I also was thinking about the 50 mm 1.8. Would the 75-300 lens be needed as well? And what about an external flash? Obviously with my budget I can't get all of that right now, but I'm not sure what I should start with, and what would be worth saving for in the near future.

I appreciate any advice, the SLR is really new to me and I want to make sure I'm investing my money wisely. Thank you for any help you can provide.

Re: Looking for some advice

ScottyP — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 01:12:29 GMT

Welcome to the forum, KAB.

The T5i for $750 has the same sensor as the T3i for $500. (Body only prices- no lens included). The only real differences are that the T5i has a touch screen and has a better autofocus system. That may justify the additional cost, but you would have to decide.

If you get the kit with a lens, I'd get the one that comes with the 18-135mm lens. It is a useful focal range and it is a newer, better image quality model than some others.

For your kids, do one thing though: get a 50mm lens. If younspend to get the camera plus the kit lens, then add in a Canon 50mm f/1.8 for just $100. If you don't spend for the kit, you have a little more money to spend on the nicer Canon 50mm f/1.4 for about $350 or so. Having an aperture wider than 2.0 (a lower f-number is a wider max aperture) gives you two things: 1.) it lets about 4 times more light into the camera than the kit lens can, so it shoots much better indoors and in low light, and 2.) it gives you the ability to have a super narrow depth of field.

And "prime" lenses (fixed length) like the 50mm give much sharper pictures than zoom lenses do, and they are also cheaper and lighter.

The shallow depth of field gives you that professional/arty look. It blurs out the background so that any ugly thing or crowd of strangers softens into an un-distracting or even pretty haze, so your subject "pops out" beautifully as the only thing in focus. It really elevates your images beyond mere snapshots.

Have fun, and good luck. The kids will never ever be as little as they are today, so you can only get these shots right now!

Re: Looking for some advice

KAB — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 03:14:41 GMT

Thank you so much for your reply. My husband refuses to let me spend more than $1000, and he's already having a small heart attack that I'm spending that much on a camera, but my girls memories will be worth it. It sounds like the T5i is a little out of my budget if I want the better lens, and if they are the same sensor system than it sounds like the T3i will be OK for me, I don't really care if it's touch screen or not, I just want something that I can grow with. If I understand correctly, I want to spend more on the lens' than the actual body anyway? So it looks like it will be the 18-135mm, and the 50mm 1.8 to start with. Will I need an external flash? Is there a difference in memory cards? Is there anything else I should consider?

Re: Looking for some advice

TCampbell — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 03:44:32 GMT

If you want to record video then the card must be a minimum of a "Class 6" (logo looks like a letter "C" with a 6 inside it) card, although a Class 10 card will be even faster (the number represents how fast the card can read and write data).

I usually suggest getting a pair of cards rather than a single large card. This has two advantages...

#1 a lot of computers have SD card slots in them and this is the quick and easy way to transfer images from camera to computer (much faster than using the USB cable). But there is a possibility you'll grab the camera, head out to take photos, and get the dreaded "no card" error only to realize the reason why is because your card is still stuck in your computer... back at home. Having a second card in the bag can save the day (don't ask me how I know this.)

#2 there is a possibility that a card can fail -- it happens. Having a second card gives you a spare so you can keep shooting.

Cards are fairly inexpensive. The guideline is roughly $1 per GB of storage capacity. E.g. expect to pay around $16 for a 16GB card (give or take).

The built-in flash on any camera is generally good for about 10 feet ... if you're lucky maybe a few feet further. But as it's a "straight on" flash, it doesn't provide a very flattering look. To have good light you need good shadows... light falling from above, or from the side will always look better than light coming straigh tfrom the camera.

An external speedlite flash can allow you to point the flash head to a wall or to the ceiling and "bounce" the light. The wall or ceiling need to be color neutral (typically white) otherwise it'll put a color cast on your subject based on the color of the wall or ceiling. Also it should preferably not be too high (there's a limit to how far the light can carry and still provide adequate illumination.)

You don't necessarily need an external speedlite on day #1.

The pop-up flash is great for "fill" light when outdoors in sun. It seems counterintuitive to use flash in the sun but it turns out the shadows cast by the sun are a bit too harsh... the "fill" flash helps weaken the strong shadows by providing gentle shadows for a much better look.

More than gear, I'd recommend a good book to help get you started. Bryan Peterson's "Understanding Exosure" is fairly heavily recommended for beginners... as are the Scott Kelby "Digital Photography" series (which I think are now up to 4 volumes.) it turns out your skill will be the biggest factor in how well your images turn out. I like to say that I don't know how to play a piano... and buying a Steinway Concert Grand isn't actually going to make me play any better. But a few books and some lessons might be a tremendous help. It's nice to have the right gear... but it's ESSENTIAL to have the right skills.

Re: Looking for some advice

KAB — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 03:56:33 GMT

Thank you! I'm not going to be using the camera for video, so I guess I don't need a fancy card, and that's a great idea to buy a pair, I can be rather forgetful. I'll put the flash on my future list, maybe I will end up not needing it at all. I will look into that book, anything I can do to improve my skills to get the best quality pictures, I'm willing to look in to and learn as much as possible.

Re: Looking for some advice

ScottyP — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 13:06:50 GMT

Hi,
You can avoid the flash for a while by just getting a collapsible reflector to bounce ambient light onto your subject. This is usually prettier light than the flash anyway if you are outside. The ones from American camera stores are more money than you need to spend. Just google for collapsible reflector and go with a Chinese import for like $19.00 or something. You can get a 5 in 1 that gives a lot of unnecessary colors, but they are awkward to use. I prefer a simple one that is silver on one side and white on the other. You want one that is 42 inches or so. They squish up into a little 10" pouch, but then burst open into the big reflector.

I will heartily second the book recommendation. Bryan Peterson's Understanding Exposure is really great for giving a new photographer a solid understanding of the underlying concepts, and it is about 65% pictures, which is ideal for a book on photography.

Re: Looking for some advice

ebiggs1 — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 13:33:36 GMT

This probably what you want.

EOS Rebel T3i digital SLR camera and EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS Type II

The list price is around $800 bucks I believe if memory serves me correctly. Don't pay list, shop around, Make sure the one you buy has the exact numbers and letters as above.

After reading your posts, this is likely more camera than you will ever need. I probably know a dozen "Moms" that have this rig.

As for additional lenses.........

I am going to deviate slightly because I don't like the 75-300mm or the 50mmm f1.8 lenses at all and I cannot recommend anybody buy them. For a Rebel I would much more prefer you get the 35mm f2 and forego any thoughts of the 50mm f1.8.

Also forget the flash.......................right off. Maybe later on but use the camera for a while first before you decide.

The T3i is a very capable camera but you must use it to learn it, whether you read books or watch videos. Go out and use the camera! And later on you can even add really great Canon lenses and show what a fantastic camera theT3i is.

Re: Looking for some advice

ScottyP — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 14:16:07 GMT

I am going to disagree with Ebiggs, but only on the 35mm vs 50mm lens part.

If the OP buys the 18-135 kit lens, then she has 35mm and 50mm both covered there. The only reason to get a prime fixed lens to double-cover that range, then, is to get a better, more specialized lens for her shooting purposes.

50mm is a perfect portrait length on a T3i. Portraits of her kids is likely to be important to her. It is also long enough to give the nice blurry background/shallow depth of field in focus effect that is so desirable.

35mm is too wide for portraits. If you get close enough to do a head or head and shoulders portrait with a 35mm lens, you start getting the unflattering distortion making their noses and foreheads look big. Yuck! And it is hard to get as blurry a background at 35mm as you would get at 50mm.

Also, the 35mm IS lens is out of her price range, and the old non-IS lens is not exactly spectacular. It may be a great lens and a better-built lens, but I don't think it is the right lens for what she will be shooting.

Re: Looking for some advice

hsbn — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 15:47:16 GMT

The card is cheap now, so you don't have to think too much. A "fast" class 10 card, 16Gb is $16 and 32Gb is $25 on Amazon everyday.

The book TC recommended is a great book. However, since you said you want to save some $. I don't recommend you to buy it. The book is more geared toward to teach how to become a "pro". In your case, I don't think it is needed yet. There is a ton of video on youtube and tons of free article online that teach you how to use the camera. I recommend the video since it's easier to follow. Even Canon has a website where you can play with all the basic camera settings.

If you really want to save, you can buy refurbished unit from Canon. I've heard a rumor in a few days they will have a Fall discount sale for those. Right now it is $399 body only, and the 18-135 lens for $400 (again refurbished prices). Check site like slickdeals.net, they post up deal for these camera all the time.

Good luck on your hunting.

Re: Looking for some advice

ensleym — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 19:13:04 GMT

I'm loving my T3i. It came with two kit lenses and I also purchased the 50mm 1.8 lens. I take tons of family photos, VBS, group outings, etc. and I've been very happy. The 50mm lens...I was not sold on it when I bought it, but the quality of my photos has gone way up since I've started using it. It stays on the camera now! ...and it is perfect for taking photos of children!

Re: Looking for some advice

KAB — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 21:46:12 GMT

You all have been EXTREMELY helpful, thank you so much! Is there a difference between EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS Type II, and EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS Standard Zoom Lens?

Re: Looking for some advice

ScottyP — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 22:31:10 GMT

Hi, KAB,

I believe Ebiggs meant to say EF-S 18-135 IS STM, not type 2. The STM is the new part. STM means "stepping motor" which was a 2012 update to the 2009 version that has the more traditional USM focus motor.

STM is packaged with T5i but not T3i. I am not 100 percent sure STM lenses work on T3i.

The two lenses are almost identical. The STM makes that version even quieter than the already quiet original USM version. The only real reason for STM is for folks who are so serious about the videos they shoot that the sound of the lens focusing would be a distraction.

You need to buy a kit lens like a 18-135 in a kit, not separately. They are a cheaper deal in a body-and-lens kit.

Re: Looking for some advice

KAB — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 22:36:59 GMT

Ok, thank you. Now I'm really excited to go camera shopping this week.

Re: Looking for some advice

ScottyP — Fri, 13 Sep 2013 22:41:41 GMT

Good luck!

FYI, if you look on www.canonpricewatch.com you will see that the T5i kit with the STM lens is $1050, and the T3i with the non-STM lens is $800.

http://www.canonpricewatch.com/prices/

Re: Looking for some advice

ebiggs1 — Sat, 14 Sep 2013 15:14:05 GMT

Yes, Scott is correct. To many numbers and letters in these cameras any more!

I did mean theCanon EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM Lens.

I do not see any reason for it not to work on a T3i. I know a person that has it on a 70D and a Mom that has it on her T4i.

Whether it is available with the T3i “kit”, I don't know that either. But it is a better lens than the original

EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS Lens. (Non STM)

Canon redesigned the innards when they added the STM motor. Plus the STM has a 7 blade aperture instead of the 6 blade for instance. The focus is much faster.

Is is a deal buster if you can't find one, no, it isn't. But I think they are only $50 bucks more or so.

Another choice is the Sigma 18-125mm f3.8-5.6 DC OS HSM. Which is a little cheaper.

I was at our local WalMart, yesterday, and slipped by the camera department. They had a T3, a T3i and the SL-1. Yours may have them also. You could go by and try them and look them over.

The only Canon lens they had on the shelf was the EF-S 55-250mm f4-5.6 IS.

You might try out the SL-1, it is a little smaller camera. It and a 18-135mm would still be close to a grand.

Re: Looking for some advice

KAB — Sun, 15 Sep 2013 00:11:54 GMT

Thank you. I'm a little bit confused about the technicalities of the lens, but I'm going to go to my local camera shop and play with them and maybe I'll understand the differences a little more. At least now I know exactly what to look at. Again, you all have been so helpful.

Re: Looking for some advice

TCampbell — Sun, 15 Sep 2013 03:04:25 GMT

Canon has three different categories of focus motors for lenses.

The basic lenses (which don't have any special tags) have the basic motors. These are both the slowest to focus and also the noisiest. Often they are not fast enough to track "action" (e.g. they may not necessarily keep up with fast moving sports).

The higher end focus motors are the "USM" -- these are Canon's Ultrasonic Motors. The motors are much quieter but they also tend to be very quick to focus -- they're responsive and generally have no trouble keeping up with fast changes in focus.

The most recent lenses are the "STM" -- these are Canon's "Stepper Motor" technology. They're faster than the basic auto-focus lenses, but not as fast as the USM. But their advantage is that they are almost completely silent (quieter than the USM.) They are so quiet that if you are shooting video and recording audio with the camera's built-in microphone, many of the lenses don't make enough noise to be heard by the microphone at all.

Re: Looking for some advice

KAB — Sun, 15 Sep 2013 03:56:20 GMT

Ok, that makes sense, thank you for that clarification.

Re: Looking for some advice

KAB — Sun, 15 Sep 2013 04:47:39 GMT

I'm seeing some kits that include a type II lens, what exactly is that, and do I want to stay away from that lens? And I understand that the 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS is the non STM, but would that be the USM? Sorry for all the questions.

Re: Looking for some advice

TCampbell — Sun, 15 Sep 2013 13:56:26 GMT

"I'm seeing some kits that include a type II lens, what exactly is that, and do I want to stay away from that lens? And I understand that the 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS is the non STM, but would that be the USM? Sorry for all the questions."

It's not a different type of lens. Canon uses the roman numerals to indicate a revised version of the previous lens.

E.g. I have a Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM. About a year after I bought that lens, Canon came out with an EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM II. The "II" has better optical quality than the original so generally you would probably prefer the II over the original.