topic Re: Built in flash malfunction in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

Built in flash malfunction

saffronica — Mon, 16 Mar 2015 00:26:00 GMT

I have a T5i that I just bought over the summer.

Just now it started doing something that I really do not like and I need to know what my next steps should be.

In any mode that uses the onboard flash

Using Auto-Focus

Using any and all lenses (kit lens, 50mm, and wide angle)

Press shutter halfway down to auto focus

Flash snaps up when subject is too dark -- however "too dark" now means a fully lit room.

When shutter is pressed halfway down the camera makes a sound like a shorted electrical wire (a "bzzt") and the flash flickers on for a second.

The display flashes BUSY

The camera does snap the photo after a delay with the flash.

But that "bzzt" sound adn the flash flicker is freaking me out.

I've read through the forums and tested it with all of my lenses, and in both AF and MF modes.

Doesn't do it in MF with any lens.

Doesn't do it in AF with live view/screen turned on, only when I use the viewfinder.

But it DOES do it with ALL lenses in AF.

And that electrical "bzzt" sound + the flash flickering is.... extremelyt unsettling.

I'm thinking it's an onboard issue with the body, but before I lose my camera for who knows how long for diagnostics and repairs I wanted to come here and see if anyone else has had the problem and if anyone knows of a fix.

Thanks!

Re: Built in flash malfunction

jrhoffman75 — Mon, 16 Mar 2015 01:06:50 GMT

Are you sure it's not the flash acting as an autofocus assist when it's too dark for normal AF?

Re: Built in flash malfunction

TCampbell — Mon, 16 Mar 2015 04:39:50 GMT

The noise you hear is the camera using the flash as a focus-assist light.

Your "fully lit" room is too dark.

What is your shooting mode? (e.g. Auto, Program, Tv, Av, Manual, etc.)

What is your ISO set to ?

Re: Built in flash malfunction

MikeSowsun — Thu, 19 Mar 2015 21:16:21 GMT

Page 300 of your T5i manual shows how to use "Custom Functions" to disable the "bzzt" sound + the flash flickering of the AF Assist.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

annhackler — Tue, 02 Aug 2016 00:31:19 GMT

I'm having a similar problem with my T6i, after a year of use. Did anyone ever answer this question to your satisfaction?

Re: Built in flash malfunction

RobertTheFat — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 16:00:37 GMT

@annhackler wrote:
I'm having a similar problem with my T6i, after a year of use. Did anyone ever answer this question to your satisfaction?

Regardless of the OP's level of satisfaction, the answer supplied by Mike, Tim, and John is almost certainly correct.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

ScottyP — Fri, 05 Aug 2016 01:24:26 GMT

Agreed. That buzzing and flashing is what the camera does when there is not enough light for it to autofocus. It can be really annoying.

A Rebel cannot focus quickly, or at all, in dim light. What is dim to a camera can look bright enough to see just fine with the human eye. That is actually one major reason I went to full frame cameras. My Rebel T3i just couldn't take a shot inside at night unless every light in the house was burning bright. It would do all of that flashing and buzzing as it tried.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

RobertTheFat — Fri, 05 Aug 2016 02:08:45 GMT

@ScottyP wrote:
Agreed. That buzzing and flashing is what the camera does when there is not enough light for it to autofocus. It can be really annoying. ...

You may be able to avoid the hissing and fizzing by using an external flash. The good ones use infrared light, not visible light from the flash head, for AF assist.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

pcdarcan — Thu, 26 Oct 2017 20:47:35 GMT

Wow! In looking for answers to this perculair flash noise, I came across this post in the Canon Cummunity site. I discovered the same thing with my newly purchased Canon 77D! Let me set the scene. In several different modes (Basic or Creative), a test flash shot in a medium lit room (mostly from the light coming from window light during mid-day) produces a most annoying behavior. When the shutter is depressed half-way down [for auto focus], it emits several rapid flashes and while this is happening, the camera makes an electrical buzzing noise! Since this is heard by the subject(s), it's both distracting and annoying, often times invoking a response, "Is there something wrong with your camera?" I also noticed that the camera is not particularly sensitive towards the light that exist in a room. In other words, if the room is not extremely well lit, it concludes that the room is much to dark and thus uses the pop-up flash, but the camera's response it so slow! For heaven's sake, my Canon G10 doesn't behave this way. I can set my G10 to 2.8 with the in-camera flash on and it fires immediately with the auto-focus working fine, too Long story short, I see that this is a problem with this line of cameras and apparently is inherited by the glorified Rebel model: 77D. I'm sorry Canon, but both this flash noise and the lack of sensitivity to existing ambient light is most disturbing. And, for those who say, add an external flash... well, I have one (430EX ii), but I'm still shocked by how insensitve the camera is to existing light. btw: The lens I was using is the Sigma 17-50mm 2.8, so don't blame the lens on this one. Finally, most annoying is the time-lapse - that busy indicator - while the camera performs the auto-focus while doing it's rapid flash firing, which results in "missed" shots. Having an on-board (pop-up) flash is excellent to have - when I don't need my external flash - but the behavior of it was so annoying, I sent the 77D camera back for a full refund. It doesn't seem like Canon wants to address this either, because apparently it's been in this line of Rebels for quite some time. I suppose they hope that the purchaser will just "live" with it. But, I'm not that type of consumer. If any camera manufacterer produces a camera that has such an annoyance, I won't keep it.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

RobertTheFat — Thu, 26 Oct 2017 21:41:22 GMT

@pcdarcan wrote:
Wow! In looking for answers to this perculair flash noise, I came across this post in the Canon Cummunity site. I discovered the same thing with my newly purchased Canon 77D! Let me set the scene. In several different modes (Basic or Creative), a test flash shot in a medium lit room (mostly from the light coming from window light during mid-day) produces a most annoying behavior. When the shutter is depressed half-way down [for auto focus], it emits several rapid flashes and while this is happening, the camera makes an electrical buzzing noise! Since this is heard by the subject(s), it's both distracting and annoying, often times invoking a response, "Is there something wrong with your camera?" I also noticed that the camera is not particularly sensitive towards the light that exist in a room. In other words, if the room is not extremely well lit, it concludes that the room is much to dark and thus uses the pop-up flash, but the camera's response it so slow! For heaven's sake, my Canon G10 doesn't behave this way. I can set my G10 to 2.8 with the in-camera flash on and it fires immediately with the auto-focus working fine, too Long story short, I see that this is a problem with this line of cameras and apparently is inherited by the glorified Rebel model: 77D. I'm sorry Canon, but both this flash noise and the lack of sensitivity to existing ambient light is most disturbing. And, for those who say, add an external flash... well, I have one (430EX ii), but I'm still shocked by how insensitve the camera is to existing light. btw: The lens I was using is the Sigma 17-50mm 2.8, so don't blame the lens on this one. Finally, most annoying is the time-lapse - that busy indicator - while the camera performs the auto-focus while doing it's rapid flash firing, which results in "missed" shots. Having an on-board (pop-up) flash is excellent to have - when I don't need my external flash - but the behavior of it was so annoying, I sent the 77D camera back for a full refund. It doesn't seem like Canon wants to address this either, because apparently it's been in this line of Rebels for quite some time. I suppose they hope that the purchaser will just "live" with it. But, I'm not that type of consumer. If any camera manufacterer produces a camera that has such an annoyance, I won't kee

You're missing two important points. One is that the human eye has a much greater dynamic range than that of any camera. So what you see as adequate indoor lighting can be very dark from the camera's point of view. The fact that you don't need an assist from the camera's built-in flash is not a reason to suppose that the camera doesn't. (Don't be embarrassed. I didn't take 10th-grade biology either, and only blundered onto this understanding later in life.)

The other point is that your G-10 undoubtedly has a much smaller sensor than your rejected 77D. A smaller sensor, for all its faults (not worth addressing here), allows a lens with a shorter focal length. And a shorter focal length means a deeper depth of field, so the autofocus mechanism doesn't have to work as hard or be as accurate.

Yeah, we (users of more sophisticated cameras) have learned to "live with it". But that doesn't mean that you have to. Today's simpleminded point-and-shoot cameras are nearly as good as my first professional-quality camera was when I bought it 59 years ago - and clearly good enough for the average hobbyist. I'm being very sincere when I assure you that there's no shame in reverting to a G-10 if it meets your requirements.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

Waddizzle — Thu, 26 Oct 2017 23:42:50 GMT

pcdarcan,

Just because your lens is listed at f/2.8, that does not mean that the camera will set the lens to f/2.8. If fact, if the “focus assist” beam is firing, then it is likely that you are using one of the Basic shooting modes, and the camera is ignoring the wide aperture that is available for it to use.

The “buzzing” that you were hearing was most likely coming from the flash tube as it strobed at a high rate. Strobes tend to make a soft “ping” sound when fired, which can sound like a buzz when the strobe is fired quickly, as during focus assist.

As far struggling to focus goes, there are two parts to that task: the camera and the lens. It is the lens that actually achieves focus, but it does so under the control of the camera. It is possible that your shooting mode, and AF point selection were the cause of your symptoms.

While it is possible that you received a bad copy, I would look elsewhere besides laying all blame on the camera. Did you go outside in the sunshine and try the camera?

Re: Built in flash malfunction

RobertTheFat — Fri, 27 Oct 2017 02:09:25 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
pcdarcan,

Just because your lens is listed at f/2.8, that does not mean that the camera will set the lens to f/2.8. If fact, if the “focus assist” beam is firing, then it is likely that you are using one of the Basic shooting modes, and the camera is ignoring the wide aperture that is available for it to use.
...

No, it will autofocus at f/2.8. It doesn't stop down to the chosen aperture, whether that aperture was chosen manually or automatically, until just before the exposure is made.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

Waddizzle — Fri, 27 Oct 2017 07:46:22 GMT

@RobertTheFat wrote:
@Waddizzle wrote:
pcdarcan,

Just because your lens is listed at f/2.8, that does not mean that the camera will set the lens to f/2.8. If fact, if the “focus assist” beam is firing, then it is likely that you are using one of the Basic shooting modes, and the camera is ignoring the wide aperture that is available for it to use.
...
No, it will autofocus at f/2.8. It doesn't stop down to the chosen aperture, whether that aperture was chosen manually or automatically, until just before the exposure is made.

I understand that. But, the OP was comparing the operation of the 77D to a G10. I suspect that the OP may have been using the Live View and the rear LCD screen to focus and shoot, mainly because the OP makes no mention of AF points. With ExpSim enabled, the lens will stop down when it focuses. I think the 77D was being used like a P&S camera.

I would not categorically rule out the Sigma lens, either. I am not impressed with the big Sigma zooms I have used in low light. The DG OS HSM system usually worked well in well lit conditions. But, the lenses would hunt in low light, until I turned off the OS system. Then, they would hunt less, but would at least manage to lock focus onto something, but not always what I wanted.

This post reminds me that I have yet to really test my 150-600 in bad light since I did the firmware update, which completely updated the focusing system. The AF update turned it into a completely different lens, one that works very well. I can use the OS system again. It used to be that the AF and OS would get into a kind of tug of war.

Also, AI Servo Mode does not work well in conditions that require the AF Assist Beam. In fact, it doesn’t seem to work.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

pcdarcan — Wed, 01 Nov 2017 18:53:03 GMT

Thanks for your reply Bob. I rarely, and I mean rarely, ever use my G10 in "Auto" mode. As a matter of fact, the manual controls (Av, Tv, P, M) is specifically why I purchased the G10 in 2008. And, I have used it with great success (indoors and outdoors). However, I'm not sure I'm buying any "excuses" for the 77D not being able to "top" the functionality of the G10, regardless of sensor-size. It's that type of "excuse" that got some Apple engineers fired when Steve Jobs ran the show at Apple, before his untimely death. The 77D is a prosumer camera built almost a decade after the G10 - it should reflect a huge leap in performance in all modes, regardless of sensor size. And, for sure, it shouldn't take a step backwards and that appears to be what it has done. It's one of those ugly sides of the coin that the marketers and salespeople just don't tell you when they hype their latest productions. Consumers, you need to demand more from your purchases. If you don't like something, return it! Thanks again Bob for the input.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

Waddizzle — Thu, 02 Nov 2017 00:24:19 GMT

@pcdarcan wrote:
Thanks for your reply Bob. I rarely, and I mean rarely, ever use my G10 in "Auto" mode. As a matter of fact, the manual controls (Av, Tv, P, M) is specifically why I purchased the G10 in 2008. And, I have used it with great success (indoors and outdoors). However, I'm not sure I'm buying any "excuses" for the 77D not being able to "top" the functionality of the G10, regardless of sensor-size. It's that type of "excuse" that got some Apple engineers fired when Steve Jobs ran the show at Apple, before his untimely death. The 77D is a prosumer camera built almost a decade after the G10 - it should reflect a huge leap in performance in all modes, regardless of sensor size. And, for sure, it shouldn't take a step backwards and that appears to be what it has done. It's one of those ugly sides of the coin that the marketers and salespeople just don't tell you when they hype their latest productions. Consumers, you need to demand more from your purchases. If you don't like something, return it! Thanks again Bob for the input.

Are you using the viewfinder? Or, are you holding the camera up, and using the LCD screen in Live View mode?

Re: Built in flash malfunction

pcdarcan — Thu, 02 Nov 2017 16:26:47 GMT

Yes, I'm using the view finder. Why do you ask?

Re: Built in flash malfunction

Waddizzle — Thu, 02 Nov 2017 22:07:29 GMT

@pcdarcan wrote:
Yes, I'm using the view finder. Why do you ask?

I will ignore that question. The reason should be obvious. Back to your problem, ... ... ...

If you have ExpSim enabled, how is the camera supposed to simulate the exposure in the viewfinder when you use a flash?

Re: Built in flash malfunction

pcdarcan — Thu, 02 Nov 2017 22:42:40 GMT

If "I" have ExpSim enabled? You see, that is the problem. I didn't enable anything. So, why do you assume this? The problem that I'm experiencing is understanding how looking through the viewfinder should be any different than if I use Liveview (outside of liveview using more battery consumption). Can you clarify my confusion with this please?

Re: Built in flash malfunction

Waddizzle — Thu, 02 Nov 2017 23:43:28 GMT

@pcdarcan wrote:
If "I" have ExpSim enabled? You see, that is the problem. I didn't enable anything. So, why do you assume this? The problem that I'm experiencing is understanding how looking through the viewfinder should be any different than if I use Liveview (outside of liveview using more battery consumption). Can you clarify my confusion with this please?

No problem. Read the Instruction Manual. You do not have to “enable” anything. Ever heard of default settings from the factory?

Why is looking through the viewfinder different from Live View? As I have already pointed out, the images are produced in two entirely different ways between the viewfinder and Live View. Having ExpSim enabled adds a new wrinkle.

My turn. I asked you a question. I suggest that you at least TRY, to find the answer on your own. Like I said, the difference should be obvious, especially in light of the fact that I have already answered my own question that I posed to you.

Re: Built in flash malfunction

Waddizzle — Thu, 02 Nov 2017 23:45:21 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
@pcdarcan wrote:
Yes, I'm using the view finder. Why do you ask?
I will ignore that question. The reason should be obvious. Back to your problem, ... ... ...

If you have ExpSim enabled, how is the camera supposed to simulate the exposure in the viewfinder when you use a flash?

How can the camera simulate the exposure without firing the flash? Because it cannot. It is impossible. Like I said, read the manual.