topic Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING] in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

zacharymarek — Sun, 26 May 2019 04:17:40 GMT

I'm not sure if this is the best place to get advice regarding my Canon EOS 80D, however i might as well give it a shot.

[This parragraph is just buildup to the problem/background info. Time crunch? Skip over it, it's not necesasy.] I've been recording videos since I was around 7 or 8 years old, and every day I have a camera in my hand, I've loved it. Throughout the years, I've saved every single penny for each step up camera I purchase, starting with my GoPro Hero+, Sony Cybershot [which is a step down from the Gopro I realized shortly after,] Canon Powershot SX730, and finally, after years of saving every penny I could and cutting back on everything else I could, I purchased the Canon EOS 80D, the camera I dreamed about for ages, with an 18-55MM Lens, a Rode microphone, and several other components (it was one of those kits on Amazon, was $999.00.) My intention is far from bragging, but so far, I love it. The videos are a huge step up from my Powershot, the photos are three or four steps up, and it's so comfortable to shoot with. I quickly fell in love and learned as much as I can about the photo aspect, and did my first photoshoot today with it- which was phenomenal! I never imagined I'd be able to take such great photos with a kit lens, let alone be able to hold such a beautiful camera. I dreamed about the 80D for so long, since around the time it came out, and haven't been able to stop smiling while holding it- until, unfortunately, now.

Although I loved shooting photos, I decided it was finally time to test out the video aspect of the camera. My main passion is making cinematic, travel, and vlogging style videos- and that was the main purpose of buying the 80D. I had even made a huge list of a bunch of different places I wanted to travel to once I got my camera- to ensure that the video quality would be top notch! I took her down to a big beach town- La Jolla, near San Diego, CA today- and tried to use the things I'd learned from other videos and tutorials in order to make sure the video was top notch. I checked the video stabilization setting, got down low and held it around waist level, walked slowly, and used a Joby tripod, the one all those vloggers use to make videos and vlog, and held the camera under the lens and at the base of the tripod/alternating between that and under the lens and the top of the camera to try to stabilize it. I was feeling really confident about it, and people thought I was weird when I was walking by really low with a a big backpack and a camera, but that's the best reaction you can get- right?

I got home just now, and excitedly threw the SD Card into my computer and looked at the photos. The first couple, where I had it on a stable ground, turned out wonderful. The rest were not wonderful, once I picked it up off the ground, I stared at the screen and it was shaking beyond repair. No matter what I tried, what angle of holding the camera, lens strap, tripod only, vlogging style, slow and fast- it is so shaky and I'm honestly a bit depressed about it.

I know that these things are possible to fix quickly and instantly- but I don't have 300 dollars to put into a gimbal, which is the starting price. I honestly don't have much more than the 13$ in my wallet right now, I spent all my savings and everything I could on this camera and am heartbroken that it's so much more difficult to record videos, even with a tripod. Considering the weight difference, I expected it to be a bit more shaky- but I put some clips into Vegas Pro 15 and they're unrepairable, even with max stabilization, and if I try to put it at max the video becomes evidently adjusted and I don't like that at all.

My style is walking around, travelling, seeing things, and recording as much of it as possible- sometimes turning the camera around to record my face. I would hate to have to change that style that's made me happy for years of my life because it's impossible to upgrade my camera like this. Eventually, I *can* buy a gimbal, and probably should with time if I want to take it to a higher level, but that's going to make it immensely difficult to start crossing places off my bucket list of travel. If anyone has any suggestions, I'm all ears. I just want to fix this minor issue and continue to love the camera I worked so hard to get. I'll upload some test footage to show you guys what I am talking about:

Video 1- test vlogging with different angles

Video 2- camera in front of me, walking slowly as possible without holding up others, really shaky

I appreciate any potential solutions! I am hired as a filmmaker for an event on June 9th and would love it fixed before then so I can practice and make sure everything is perfect. Thank you for your time everyone- happy memorial day weekend!

~Zarek

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

Johnw1 — Sun, 26 May 2019 06:24:57 GMT

Still photography is a lot different from making videos. If you want to shoot yourself you need a camera man. The notion that a good video can be done hand holding and point it at oneself is based on phone cameras not real ones.

If you want to start taking compelling videos stop putting youself into the frame. Use a tripod. Carefully compose the shot. If you have to have yorself in the frame you still need to use a tripod. Personally, I can't see the reason why the sefle craze has become popular. Is it that the new generation is narsistic?

Watch some travellogs and notice how the various shots are done. One thing selfe makers forget is when you put youself into the frame it blocks the senery.

As to camera shake this will hapen when you put a heavey camera on the end of a stick and try to hold it steady.

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

zacharymarek — Sun, 26 May 2019 08:36:51 GMT

@Johnw1 wrote:
Still photography is a lot different from making videos. If you want to shoot yourself you need a camera man. The notion that a good video can be done hand holding and point it at oneself is based on phone cameras not real ones.

Fair enough, yeah I have never shot with a DSLR camera now and I guess it's an expected result that I need to get someone to tag along with me. Unfortunately very rarely that is a possibility so I will suffice with not shooting myself, like you suggested in part two as well.

I always have a Joby Gorrilapod- the one with the weird flexible legs- with me when shooting, and that's what I was using in the videos. I'm assuming that when you say to get a tripod, you are meaning one that is either a bit more stable, or a bit more larger- or a mixture of the two. Would you be able to suggest me a couple tripods that you think would work better than what I have? Here's a link to what I am talking about [amazon,] however the price was about 40$ different when I purchased it for my old Canon Powershot.

I have a pretty large tripod (and an old one, the Velbon VGB-3C (amazon URL) which works alright with a simple video test, obviously there will always be a bit of shaking and I can accept that, but the problem comes in when I mention how uncomfortable it is to shoot with. It gets tedious to carry after awhile, and is definitely not travel size. Plus the grip is terrible on it/not really a grip at all.

I'm open to any suggestions. And I'll definitely take your advice to make more compelling videos by cutting out my face from it. The main reason I personally used that style is to give information about whatever the subject I am talking about is- mostly background information on places I am exploring, or to record my reaction to something I just showed- but the primary reason that the "selfie craze" has become so popular is because it is easy to do, and attracts younger audiences really easily. I agree that it's really overrated and generally only flip the camera when necessary.

Thanks in advance!

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

Johnw1 — Sun, 26 May 2019 10:18:54 GMT

I perfer a strong tripod. That also means heavy. Some lighter tripods have a hook at the bottom to attach a weight.

A tripod that is unstable is a waste of time.

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

Waddizzle — Sun, 26 May 2019 10:45:50 GMT

“I have a pretty large tripod (and an old one, the Velbon VGB-3C [LINK DELETED] which works alright with a simple video test, obviously there will always be a bit of shaking and I can accept that, but the problem comes in when I mention how uncomfortable it is to shoot with. It gets tedious to carry after awhile, and is definitely not travel size. Plus the grip is terrible on it/not really a grip at all.”

I do not recommend buying a gimbal at this time Invest in a real tripod. Real tripods do not have plastic heads or plastic gears. A real tripod has an interchangeable head, so that you can mix and match tripod legs and tripod heads however you want.

I would recommend a video tripod because most a much more stable than tripods aimed at photographers. But, video tripods also tend to be heavier, which partially accounts for their better stability. Stay away from tripods with tall center columns. A raised center column creates an unstable tripod. Professional tripods for both photography and videography lack a center column lack a center column for this very reason.

I do not recommend shopping on Amazon for big ticket items, either. If you bought your camera on Amazon, I hope you got a valid warranty with it. The lack of a warranty is why many items are so cheap. I would recommend B&H Photo Video in NYC for online purchases of camera/video gear and accessories.

Visit th B&H site, and browse their selection of photo tripods and video tripods. I recommend a professional video tripod with a video head. Two brands that I would recommend are Manfrotto and Benro. They both make very good tripod kits for photo and video. I prefer Benro because of the quality of their tripod bags. Plan to spend upwards of a couple of hundred dollars.

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

John_SD — Sun, 26 May 2019 15:27:14 GMT

"...after years of saving every penny I could and cutting back on everything else I could, I purchased the Canon EOS 80...My main passion is making cinematic, travel, and vlogging style videos- and that was the main purpose of buying the 80D..."

I don't own an 80D, and I have no interest in shooting videos, but I have heard nothing but good about the camera from people whose opinions I trust. None of these guys are "vloggers." I am convinced that if their "main passion" was making videos, they would have chosen a proper video camera. What do you think of the 80D for stills? Since you already have it, why not learn to use the camera for DSLR photography?

"I took her down to a big beach town- La Jolla, near San Diego, CA today- and tried to use the things I'd learned from other videos and tutorials in order to make sure the video was top notch."

I have shot there many times, and also along the tidepools by Cabrillo. Most people walk along the sea wall by Children's Pool and photograph the seals. Did you venture further up toward the cliffs and shoot the sea lions at the Cove? An APS-C is ideal there.

"My style is walking around, travelling, seeing things, and recording as much of it as possible- sometimes turning the camera around to record my face."

Indeed.

"I appreciate any potential solutions! I am hired as a filmmaker for an event on June 9th and would love it fixed before then so I can practice and make sure everything is perfect."

By all accounts the 80D is a superb DSLR camera for taking photographs. I think you are missing out on its great strengths by trying to shoot videos with it, which you seem unprepared for.

Best of luck in figuring out what you want to do with your camera.

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

wq9nsc — Sun, 26 May 2019 18:59:16 GMT

I agree with John that the 80D (and similar DSLR bodies) shine at still photography while providing video capability as a nice bonus that works OK for some purposes but it isn't the primary design intent of that body. If you want to use it for video blogging and similar pursuits then you will have to treat it as a DSLR with video capability subject to constraints as such and one requirement will be to use a proper tripod like Wadizzle suggested.

Some of the players on my daughter's varsity soccer team needed some video for skills development and after shooting a little video with my 1DX and 1DX 2 bodies I quickly decided the hand held fast following of action was not a great match for those bodies. I picked up a Canon XF-400 which works very nicely for such video tasks; it doesn't allow me to use my large collection of EF lenses but the built in lens is fine for my needs and its multi-mode integrated stabilization system works extremely well and was probably far simpler to implement for Canon since it only has to work perfectly with that single lens and sensor setup unlike the IS system built into EF series lenses. I briefly considered an EOS cinema body but that was overkill and less well suited for my needs.

In my view, my 1DX and 1DX 2 bodies provide excellent stills and will also produce extremely good quality video under the right conditions. The XF-400 does a great job with video and although it can capture stills it is far better at being a video camera. Rarely does a combined tool cover two greatly disparate tasks equally well and such tools are best chosen with the primary task in mind accepting that the secondary task will not be as well implemented.

Rodger

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

ebiggs1 — Sun, 26 May 2019 22:10:21 GMT

Rodger, ...............

"My main passion is making cinematic, travel, and vlogging style videos-..."

I have yet to understand why people that state a goal like that buy a DSLR. My goal is to plow a field so I am going to buy a 4WD Ford F150 with a hitch on it. Yeah I could pull a plow with it but a trip to the John Deere dealer would have been a better idea.

People if your, "My main passion is making ... videos" buy a real video camera!

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

zacharymarek — Mon, 27 May 2019 16:48:25 GMT

@Johnw1 wrote:
I perfer a strong tripod. That also means heavy. Some lighter tripods have a hook at the bottom to attach a weight.
A tripod that is unstable is a waste of time.

I'll go out as soon as I can to invest in a stronger tripod. And I believe it was you, but someone said something about B&H photo, I'll give that a try as well. I appreciate the feedback.

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

zacharymarek — Mon, 27 May 2019 16:51:44 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
“I have a pretty large tripod (and an old one, the Velbon VGB-3C [LINK DELETED] which works alright with a simple video test, obviously there will always be a bit of shaking and I can accept that, but the problem comes in when I mention how uncomfortable it is to shoot with. It gets tedious to carry after awhile, and is definitely not travel size. Plus the grip is terrible on it/not really a grip at all.”

I do not recommend buying a gimbal at this time Invest in a real tripod. Real tripods do not have plastic heads or plastic gears. A real tripod has an interchangeable head, so that you can mix and match tripod legs and tripod heads however you want.

I would recommend a video tripod because most a much more stable than tripods aimed at photographers. But, video tripods also tend to be heavier, which partially accounts for their better stability. Stay away from tripods with tall center columns. A raised center column creates an unstable tripod. Professional tripods for both photography and videography lack a center column lack a center column for this very reason.

I do not recommend shopping on Amazon for big ticket items, either. If you bought your camera on Amazon, I hope you got a valid warranty with it. The lack of a warranty is why many items are so cheap. I would recommend B&H Photo Video in NYC for online purchases of camera/video gear and accessories.

Visit th B&H site, and browse their selection of photo tripods and video tripods. I recommend a professional video tripod with a video head. Two brands that I would recommend are Manfrotto and Benro. They both make very good tripod kits for photo and video. I prefer Benro because of the quality of their tripod bags. Plan to spend upwards of a couple of hundred dollars.

Thank you for the reply and the advice. I've done a quick test with a strong tripod (it has a center column that is raised, so it's not something I would eventually purchase) and it's a lot better so I'm going to assume that an even stronger tripod will be the best I can get for my money. And I just looked at B&H Photo and it looks a lot more reliable than amazon. I couldn't get over the fear that I would be purchasing something that's a scam, or made poorly, or has a terrible warranty on Amazon so I'll veer clear from there in the future. This is my first time making a big ticket purchase online, other than small gifts and such, and I was unprepared as to what is the best way to go about that. Do you have any specific video tripod suggestions that I should look for?

~Zarek

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

zacharymarek — Mon, 27 May 2019 16:55:53 GMT

@John_SD wrote:
"...after years of saving every penny I could and cutting back on everything else I could, I purchased the Canon EOS 80...My main passion is making cinematic, travel, and vlogging style videos- and that was the main purpose of buying the 80D..."

I don't own an 80D, and I have no interest in shooting videos, but I have heard nothing but good about the camera from people whose opinions I trust. None of these guys are "vloggers." I am convinced that if their "main passion" was making videos, they would have chosen a proper video camera. What do you think of the 80D for stills? Since you already have it, why not learn to use the camera for DSLR photography?

"I took her down to a big beach town- La Jolla, near San Diego, CA today- and tried to use the things I'd learned from other videos and tutorials in order to make sure the video was top notch."

I have shot there many times, and also along the tidepools by Cabrillo. Most people walk along the sea wall by Children's Pool and photograph the seals. Did you venture further up toward the cliffs and shoot the sea lions at the Cove? An APS-C is ideal there.

"My style is walking around, travelling, seeing things, and recording as much of it as possible- sometimes turning the camera around to record my face."

Indeed.

"I appreciate any potential solutions! I am hired as a filmmaker for an event on June 9th and would love it fixed before then so I can practice and make sure everything is perfect."

By all accounts the 80D is a superb DSLR camera for taking photographs. I think you are missing out on its great strengths by trying to shoot videos with it, which you seem unprepared for.

Best of luck in figuring out what you want to do with your camera.

Thank you for your thoughts. I have actually used the 80D extensively for photos as well, and am likewise blown away by the capiabilities that it has. Although I did primarily buy it for videography, I also bought it for photos- on my trip to the Anza-Borrego Desert State Park/Salton Sea area in April, I had an additional camera for photos and used the Powershot for videos. It was extremely difficult to hike, use the photo camera, the video camera, and carry a tripod at the same time during the night. I bought the 80D as well because it would make it so much easier to have a bit of both without requiring two camera on my neck.

The 80D is a great camera for everything. I feel like my big weakness right now is that I'm not sure of the best way to use it to capture the videos and photos that I want. I will be taking the other commenters' suggestions and be purchasing a strong tripod, and will make sure there is a balance between photo and video in the future.

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

zacharymarek — Mon, 27 May 2019 17:03:59 GMT

@wq9nsc wrote:
I agree with John that the 80D (and similar DSLR bodies) shine at still photography while providing video capability as a nice bonus that works OK for some purposes but it isn't the primary design intent of that body. If you want to use it for video blogging and similar pursuits then you will have to treat it as a DSLR with video capability subject to constraints as such and one requirement will be to use a proper tripod like Wadizzle suggested.

Some of the players on my daughter's varsity soccer team needed some video for skills development and after shooting a little video with my 1DX and 1DX 2 bodies I quickly decided the hand held fast following of action was not a great match for those bodies. I picked up a Canon XF-400 which works very nicely for such video tasks; it doesn't allow me to use my large collection of EF lenses but the built in lens is fine for my needs and its multi-mode integrated stabilization system works extremely well and was probably far simpler to implement for Canon since it only has to work perfectly with that single lens and sensor setup unlike the IS system built into EF series lenses. I briefly considered an EOS cinema body but that was overkill and less well suited for my needs.

In my view, my 1DX and 1DX 2 bodies provide excellent stills and will also produce extremely good quality video under the right conditions. The XF-400 does a great job with video and although it can capture stills it is far better at being a video camera. Rarely does a combined tool cover two greatly disparate tasks equally well and such tools are best chosen with the primary task in mind accepting that the secondary task will not be as well implemented.

Rodger

Hey, I looked into each of the cameras you suggested, and although I certainly agree that each of those would be better than the 80D, it's way out of my budget. Despite having work and such, things haven't been easy recently, trying to get to work and back everyday is a challenge and I didn't have much room for spending upwards of the 1000 ish I did spend on my camera. If it took this long to save up for the one I have, I can only imagine how long it'd take for an XF-400 or even the 1DX/1DX2. And lenses, I've noted that as well. I might try to save up and see if I can get a lens that might work better for videos. The one I have is the standard kit lens, so it's not exceptional when it comes to video, or photo for that matter, and I'm sure that changing that would improve the quality.

I'm going to quit replying right now to my responses, thank you all for the feedback and thoughts. I also appreciate the attitude some of you directed towards me. I realized that I truly didn't research every aspect of videography, and the style I wanted to capture with the camera, as much as I had thought I did. I'm going to rethink my video style and steer away from "vlogging/putting myself in the frame." in order to provide more interesting travel content. And yes, I'll get a tripod. If anyone has video/strong tripod suggestions, I'm all ears.

~Zarek

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

wq9nsc — Mon, 27 May 2019 19:08:35 GMT

Buy a good tripod but take a look at the used department from places like B&H. You can look at buying a used tripod in good condition as either spending less than what you otherwise would OR getting a better quality tripod for the same price or less than a mediocre quality new unit.

Also watch for closeouts from the same sources.

Rodger

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

John_SD — Mon, 27 May 2019 21:47:03 GMT

@zacharymarek wrote:

Thank you for your thoughts. I have actually used the 80D extensively for photos as well, and am likewise blown away by the capiabilities that it has. Although I did primarily buy it for videography, I also bought it for photos- on my trip to the Anza-Borrego Desert State Park/Salton Sea area in April

I also shoot in the desert often and have been to the Anza-Borrego many a time. If you haven't checked out the slot canyon by the old Calcite Mine, put it on your to-do list for the next time. Walking through there you'll feel like you're on another planet. Bring extra batteries and water. Hours will go by before you realize it.

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

Waddizzle — Mon, 27 May 2019 21:49:42 GMT

“The one I have is the standard kit lens, so it's not exceptional when it comes to video, or photo for that matter, and I'm sure that changing that would improve the quality.”

Actually, the EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM kit lens is ideally designed to take full advantage of the Dual Pixel AF system. In fact, all of the EF-S IS STM zooms are expressly designed to work with DPAF. Unfortunately, none of the lenses are very fast, and only the EF-S STM zooms can take advantage of DPAF. This means that a prime like the EF 50mm f/1.8 STM lens cannot take full advantage of DPAF’s features.

As far as tripods go, I am going to assume that you have a budget similar to your gimbal budget, $300. The Benro tripods cost less than the Manfrotto tripods. In your price range, I would recommend this Benro.

But, B&H is always putting stuff on sale for a day. I caught one similar to this Manfrotto at 50% off two years ago.

I got lucky to catch that one a such a deep discount. The previoious kit was being discontinued in favor of this one.

Re: Feeling a bit discouraged, would love some advice [VIDEO SHOOTING]

Waddizzle — Mon, 27 May 2019 22:43:18 GMT

I just noticed that B&H may have a solution to [your] original [problem] with using the 80D on a selfie stick. The Gopro Fusion 360 degree camera is on sale at 50% off. You can do pretty powerful editing with the software.

Results do not have to look like a fishbowl. They can look like regular video, but you can use their software to pan and zoom in any direction Stick one of these one the end of a selfie stick, and you will have a much lighter load. It will not perform as well under less than the best lighting conditions, though.

[EDIT]. My vision has been getting far worse lately, folks.