topic Re: Best rebel series for film making in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 19:55:36 GMT

I have looked at the t2i t3i t4i t5i and even the t6i as a worthy buy for a film making camera. The issue I am having is making sense of all the minuet differences when it comes to film making and video only as most reviews focus mostly if not all on pictures. I figured the t2i or t3i shooting raw using magic lantern would get me the detail I want for post production editing. However the thought of causing issues with my camera scares me. Which is why I have a few questions. Btw my up coming project is going to be an action/horror film. Basically requires detail for post editing and use with adobe after effects and a good amount of low light shooting.

1. Is there a point in the rebel lineup (t2i t3i t4i t5i t6i) where the features given by magic lantern become default on the camera? (Thinking of raw footage, slo mo, etc). And of course if one model has features that don't benefit a film maker then please let me know to drop that option.

2. would the Panasonic gh4 with the metabones speed booster (raises low light performance) be a better choice for overall film making for the money or is the price for that setup just way too much compared to the cost efffectivness of the rebel series?

3. Is there a speed booster(or something that raises low light performance) for the canon rebel series?

This is going to be my first dslr and my first serious dive into HD film making. A good friend told me to work on my story telling and shot setup before taking this leap. But I realized where the ceiling for picture quality, editability, and shot design without the great glass and components of a dslr.

Any help would be great, thank you

Re: Best rebel series for film making

John_SD — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 20:21:31 GMT

Film making?

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 20:28:58 GMT

Short films, indie, trailers, etc.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

RobertTheFat — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 21:00:57 GMT

A Rebel - any Rebel - is a still camera, not a video camera. Its video capability is basically an add-on. Your requirements make it sound as though you need a video camera. Is there some reason why you're not going down that road?

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Waddizzle — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 21:01:22 GMT

The best way to answer your questions is to gain some experience. In fact, you may have bigger questions looming at you. Camera selection is important, but it is just the beginning of the process of producing a feature length film. In most cases, post production is more time consuming than the filming phase.

1. I would not recommend installing Magic Lantern on a new camera that is still under warranty, although there are a great many people who swear by the software. I would note recommend installing it on a camera that is out of warranty, either, because I feel it pushes the limits of the hardware beyond the design limitations.

2. I am not familiar with the GH4 and the Meabones boosters, although I have heard of them before. A Rebel would not be my camera of choice for shooting a feature length film. In fact, most DSLRs are tend to overheat with extended use in video mode. I would suggest that you aim a little bit higher than a Rebel, quite a bit. Looks at the Cinema EOS C100 cameras.

3. I am not familiar with any speed boosters for Rebels. Seeing how Rebels are such a poor fit for serious vide applications, I doubt if anyone has produced one. Boosters are for cameras with poor dynamic range, and limited ISO range. Or, for use with lenses with narrow apertures. I would recommend buying better gear, instead of resorting to such gear.

In general, DSLRs are not designed for making feature length films, although some of the top of line models can do it, and are designed to be able to do it.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 21:16:18 GMT

I was looking at dslr's due to them being kinda the next rung on the ladder as far as tech goes for me and I wouldn't be doing anything longer than 45 minutes. As well as the price tag being lower than the c100 so I could afford some glass. Had no clue the c100 even existed actually. I pretty much went online and looked up bet beginner cameras for film makers and dslrs were the only ones on the lists. So I figured that would be a good starting point.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Waddizzle — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 21:29:48 GMT

@Paulyfe12 wrote:
I was looking at dslr's due to them being kinda the next rung on the ladder as far as tech goes for me and I wouldn't be doing anything longer than 45 minutes. As well as the price tag being lower than the c100 so I could afford some glass. Had no clue the c100 even existed actually. I pretty much went online and looked up bet beginner cameras for film makers and dslrs were the only ones on the lists. So I figured that would be a good starting point.

Would 45 minutes be the length of an edited "film." Or, would that be the length of a continuous shot. I ask because DSLRs are limited to 29:59, or less than 30 minutes. Furthermore, DSLRs tend to overheat with extended use in video modes.

A Rebel is a good place to start. I would recommend the T7i, but it has a smallish battery. A better choice would be the 80D for film making. LIke I said, Rebels are not well suited for shooting video. They are designed to be easy for new users to learn how to shoot still photographs. The ability to record video is an afterthought feature, added only because the nuts and bolts to do it are already there in place. All it requires is additional programming in the firmware.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 21:55:55 GMT

Yea it would be an edited 45 minute film, continuous shots would only last about 2 minutes or so. And like I said I have been using very low level stuff, at one point I was playing with iPhone videos just as a means to work on editing scenes together and setting up transitions. But like I said the use of lenses and depth of field changes give a cinematic look and feels. That's kinda where I felt like Next step would be for me.

I have looked at the t7i, but like I stated in my question, I am curious if it's features extend way beyond what's important. Like wifi connectivity, and photograph only focused features aren't too important to me. That's why I was leaning towards the t5i as it seems to possess the best video recording abilities of that group and the t6i and t7i have extraneous features that would not be usable for my needs. Basically, the best functioning of the bunch for video recording, video quality, low light performance, etc

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 21:56:49 GMT

I'll have to look at the 80dband see if it's feasible price wise

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Waddizzle — Sun, 06 Aug 2017 23:32:21 GMT

@Paulyfe12 wrote:
I'll have to look at the 80dband see if it's feasible price wise

Check out the Canon Online Refurbished Store. There is a link in the lower right corner to the home page of the Canon E-Store.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

John_SD — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 00:55:35 GMT

@Paulyfe12 wrote:
However the thought of causing issues with my camera scares me. Which is why I have a few questions. Btw my up coming project is going to be an action/horror film.

Dude, no offense, but you're barking up the wrong tree and you're getting a lot of well-intentioned but bad advice for your circumstances.

Forget the dSLR.

Have you gone to film school? Do you have any clue about how to make a coherent film, beyond "point and shoot"? I ask you these questions because you sound like a guy with delusions of grandeur rather than someone with a plan. Seriously, film makers aren't out there shooting legitimate "action/horror" films with a Rebel.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 03:29:41 GMT

Well dude, the advice I am being given, is much appreciated for the simple fact that those people decided to take a moment and give me a helpful hint at what may help me in my venture.

Speaking of which, my project is not meant to be a shot at being noticed by someone for my cinematography or story telling skills. I will do the best with the knowledge I have, learn my lessons and take critiques and try again. I was a computer graphics and film editing major in college, but then switched majors and kept this as a hobby. As for my formal education in film making, I have not gone to film school and before you jump down my throats about that, my reference to short films, indie films or trailers for films is simply an idea of the type of project I would try to accomplish. I never stated I was a professional director, photographer or cinematographer, I never claimed to be a film school graduate and I never claimed that this was a "legitimate" project idea. This is purely a hobby and a passion that I have. I have a career elsewhere that pays for my passions such as filmmaking and photography. Last I checked a hobby was something outside your profession that you could indulge, research and experiment in because you enjoyed it, not because you received a degree In it.

Seriously I didn't come in here to annoy you, you could have just left me be and go with the advice I was given by these fine people that took the time to help me. I am not taking anything away from you from asking these questions, it's my money, my hobby, my time.

Any other questions for me? Or have I accurately answered yours to the point that I do not need to address you anymore and I can focus on those people kind enough to be helpful?

Re: Best rebel series for film making

RobertTheFat — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 04:51:28 GMT

@Paulyfe12 wrote:
Well dude, the advice I am being given, is much appreciated for the simple fact that those people decided to take a moment and give me a helpful hint at what may help me in my venture.

Speaking of which, my project is not meant to be a shot at being noticed by someone for my cinematography or story telling skills. I will do the best with the knowledge I have, learn my lessons and take critiques and try again. I was a computer graphics and film editing major in college, but then switched majors and kept this as a hobby. As for my formal education in film making, I have not gone to film school and before you jump down my throats about that, my reference to short films, indie films or trailers for films is simply an idea of the type of project I would try to accomplish. I never stated I was a professional director, photographer or cinematographer, I never claimed to be a film school graduate and I never claimed that this was a "legitimate" project idea. This is purely a hobby and a passion that I have. I have a career elsewhere that pays for my passions such as filmmaking and photography. Last I checked a hobby was something outside your profession that you could indulge, research and experiment in because you enjoyed it, not because you received a degree In it.

Seriously I didn't come in here to annoy you, you could have just left me be and go with the advice I was given by these fine people that took the time to help me. I am not taking anything away from you from asking these questions, it's my money, my hobby, my time.

Any other questions for me? Or have I accurately answered yours to the point that I do not need to address you anymore and I can focus on those people kind enough to be helpful?

John was not trying to insult you nor to demean your interest in your hobby. He was trying to warn you away from a course of action that some of us fear will lead to disappointment. We hear regularly from aspiring amateur videographers who lament the failure of Rebels (and sometimes even more expensive DSLRs) to meet requirements less demanding than yours appear to be. You don't have to let John's concerns dictate your decision, but you should at least consider the possibility that he may be right. After all, you're the one who asked for advice.

The Internet has always been a place where people tend to speak more bluntly than they do in real life. Experienced users understand that and usually try to develop a thick skin. But on the Internet or off, it's apt to be self-defeating to "shoot the messenger" who confronts you with information that you'd prefer not to hear.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 05:30:32 GMT

From what I have seen from video shot on the rebel cameras, I think I will be able to make do or if I can find refurbished or second hand c100, 70d or 80d I will go that route. After seeing how the rebel cameras perform in countless videos I think I can safely say i know it's limits which is why I offered other models like the Panasonic gh4 and I am now looking at the c100 and 70d and 80d cameras. I never blame the equipment for how it performs. It's made to function a certain way. Worst comes to worst I still have a much higher quality tool to work with than I am currently using. I am not demanding crystal clear images and detail. that's found in multi thousand dollar cameras, and multi thousand dollar lenses. I am aware that he was warning about the rebel cameras performance, I can accept that. What I cannot Accept is him insinuating that I have no clue what I am doing and making it seem like I have no business doing this because he thinks I have no skill, no desire to further my skill and lack the education required to do so. Blunt is blunt but he went on a tangent about things other than what was asked. He was belittling my idea for a project and insisting that I had "delusions of grandeur". Keep in mind his statement was based on nothing else he knows about me besides my questions. I can take critiques on the camera choices and combinations because that was asked by me. but do not open your mouth about my reasons for doing for looking into this and wanting to do this project that I have created on my own time. My reasons are my own, not his.

Bottom line, Keep it about the equipment

Re: Best rebel series for film making

John_SD — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 14:15:01 GMT

@Paulyfe12 wrote:
From what I have seen from video shot on the rebel cameras, I think I will be able to make do or if I can find refurbished or second hand c100, 70d or 80d I will go that route. After seeing how the rebel cameras perform in countless videos I think I can safely say i know it's limits which is why I offered other models like the Panasonic gh4 and I am now looking at the c100 and 70d and 80d cameras. I never blame the equipment for how it performs. It's made to function a certain way. Worst comes to worst I still have a much higher quality tool to work with than I am currently using. I am not demanding crystal clear images and detail. that's found in multi thousand dollar cameras, and multi thousand dollar lenses. I am aware that he was warning about the rebel cameras performance, I can accept that. What I cannot Accept is him insinuating that I have no clue what I am doing and making it seem like I have no business doing this because he thinks I have no skill, no desire to further my skill and lack the education required to do so. Blunt is blunt but he went on a tangent about things other than what was asked. He was belittling my idea for a project and insisting that I had "delusions of grandeur". Keep in mind his statement was based on nothing else he knows about me besides my questions. I can take critiques on the camera choices and combinations because that was asked by me. but do not open your mouth about my reasons for doing for looking into this and wanting to do this project that I have created on my own time. My reasons are my own, not his.

Bottom line, Keep it about the equipment

Stop whining. Had I known some truthful commentary would have put you in meltdown mode, I would have never responded to you.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 14:28:35 GMT

If what I shoot sucks, it's on me. I had questions about what to use and what would be the best option based on what others have said and what I could grow into. If it makes you feel better I do a ton of research and talk with others who have gone to film school and are actively working in film. I study cinematography, proper use of light, depth of field use, etc, on my own time. so unless your truthful commentary was basically telling me I sound like I don't have a clue what I am doing, I don't know exactly what your purpose was for commenting. And btw "forget dslrs" ok fine, so what should I be looking at then? Other people may have said no to dslrs like you did, but then they gave another idea and a good reason. You just said no, that's not helping.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Stephen — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 14:40:02 GMT

Alright, you guys have gone far enough off topic. Reign it in, please.

Please review the "Participation" section of the FORUM GUIDELINES if you have questions.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 14:46:42 GMT

I agree, which is why I asked John what his opinion was as far as what to use if not a dslr. I don't Want this to become pages of us going back and forth, that's not helping anyone.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

TTMartin — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 15:47:12 GMT

No Metabones Speed Booster for the Rebel Series, but, I believe there is one for the EOS M.

The EOS M5 with it's dual pixel AF sensor would be worth looking at.

Re: Best rebel series for film making

Paulyfe12 — Mon, 07 Aug 2017 16:02:39 GMT

The M5, alright I'll take a look thanks. And yea I searched for a speedbooster for the rebels and didn't find anything. Just figured maybe someone knew something I couldn't find