topic Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

Waddizzle — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 12:29:18 GMT

My favorite, NYC based, online Canon retailer is holding an event today, introducing the 30MB 5D mark IV. The specifications for the camera are online, and the camera is available for pre-order. It is priced comparable to the 5Ds cameras. It looks like a winner.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

RobertTheFat — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 16:02:35 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
My favorite, NYC based, online Canon retailer is holding an event today, introducing the 30MB 5D mark IV. The specifications for the camera are online, and the camera is available for pre-order. It is priced comparable to the 5Ds cameras. It looks like a winner.

The 5D4 was more or less expected – some might even say overdue. But it's accompanied by several lens upgrades, and I'm not sure any of us saw that coming.

Hmmm... I guess it's just two new lenses. In the email I thought it looked like more. Anyway, the two are upgrades of already very popular lenses.

BTW, I can't help noticing that the 5D4/24-105 II kit isn't much of a bargain. It costs $1 more than buying the camera and the lens separately!

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

TTMartin — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 13:09:08 GMT

@RobertTheFat wrote:
@Waddizzle wrote:
My favorite, NYC based, online Canon retailer is holding an event today, introducing the 30MB 5D mark IV. The specifications for the camera are online, and the camera is available for pre-order. It is priced comparable to the 5Ds cameras. It looks like a winner.
The 5D4 was more or less expected – some might even say overdue. But it's accompanied by several lens upgrades, and I'm not sure any of us saw that coming.

The EF 24-105 f/4L IS was in desperate need of updating.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

RobertTheFat — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 13:26:55 GMT

@TTMartin wrote:
@RobertTheFat wrote:
@Waddizzle wrote:
My favorite, NYC based, online Canon retailer is holding an event today, introducing the 30MB 5D mark IV. The specifications for the camera are online, and the camera is available for pre-order. It is priced comparable to the 5Ds cameras. It looks like a winner.
The 5D4 was more or less expected – some might even say overdue. But it's accompanied by several lens upgrades, and I'm not sure any of us saw that coming.
The EF 24-105 f/4L IS was in desperate need of updating.

Y'know, I lot of people seem to say that, but I've gotten very good results with mine. Maybe I just got an especially good copy.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

ebiggs1 — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 14:13:11 GMT

B from B,

"... but I've gotten very good results ..."

As you already know the ef 24-105mm f4L is my rated 'best buy' in a Canon "L" lens. I have had good luck with several of them over the years so I can't complain either. Made a lot of money with them. But you can make good, gooder! Can't you? Also as a general rule of thumb Canon lenses beat brand-N consistently with few exceptions. One is the cheap 50mm f1.8, brand-N is better. The other is Nikon's verison of the 24-105. The AF-S Nikkor 24-120mm f/4G ED VR Lens. Perhaps I will have to remove it from that side of the ledger but the "L" will still not have 120mm.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

ebiggs1 — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 14:16:21 GMT

Bob
Boston, Massachusetts USA

Speaking of goodness, the 5D Mk III is/was already a good camera. As good as it gets some say, including me. I guess we will see if the Mk IV is gooder!

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

RobertTheFat — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 15:15:03 GMT

@ebiggs1 wrote:
Bob
Boston, Massachusetts USA

Speaking of goodness, the 5D Mk III is/was already a good camera. As good as it gets some say, including me. I guess we will see if the Mk IV is gooder!

Well, 30 Mp is not to be sneered at, assuming it doesn't compromise the camera's low-light performance compared to the 5D3. I suppose the dual-pixel autofocus is A Good Thing as well. The WiFi, touch screen, and alleged video improvements I could easily live without if that would lower the price a bit.

Are they going to keep making the 5D3 or phase it out when the present stock is exhausted? (I ask because I assume that your Canon sources are better than mine.)

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

TTMartin — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 16:32:40 GMT

@RobertTheFat wrote:
@TTMartin wrote:
@RobertTheFat wrote:
@Waddizzle wrote:
My favorite, NYC based, online Canon retailer is holding an event today, introducing the 30MB 5D mark IV. The specifications for the camera are online, and the camera is available for pre-order. It is priced comparable to the 5Ds cameras. It looks like a winner.
The 5D4 was more or less expected – some might even say overdue. But it's accompanied by several lens upgrades, and I'm not sure any of us saw that coming.
The EF 24-105 f/4L IS was in desperate need of updating.
Y'know, I lot of people seem to say that, but I've gotten very good results with mine. Maybe I just got an especially good copy.

It's good stopped down especially at the long end, but, wide open it leaves a lot to be desired. In my opinion what you are paying for in an L lens is great image quality, even when wide open, the original EF 24-105 f/4L IS just doesn't deliver in that regard. I'm sure that will have changed with the new one.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

ebiggs1 — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 19:26:18 GMT

B from B,

"Are they going to keep making the 5D3 or phase it out when the present stock is exhausted?"

I suspect the last 5d3 has already been made. Maybe we'll see some good close-outs?

You are right 30 vs 22. At one time 8 mp was all a camera had instead of just an update.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

diverhank — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 21:46:16 GMT

@RobertTheFat wrote:
The 5D4 was more or less expected – some might even say overdue. But it's accompanied by several lens upgrades, and I'm not sure any of us saw that coming.

Hmmm... I guess it's just two new lenses. In the email I thought it looked like more. Anyway, the two are upgrades of already very popular lenses.

BTW, I can't help noticing that the 5D4/24-105 II kit isn't much of a bargain. It costs $1 more than buying the camera and the lens separately!

None of these was a surprise for me...the rumours had been out for several months regarding the Mark IV and the 24-105II and the 16-35 III and they were dead accurate.

People complained about the previous version of the two lenses that got upgraded. I had both of them and thought they weren't too bad at all. I don't see an overwhelming need to upgrade.

Interesting observation on the kit price...I guess we won't be seeing heavily discounted 24-105 II lenses anytime soon like we enjoyed with the 24-105 version I.

Regarding the 5D Mark IV, even though it's not obvious reading the specs, based on the 80D and 1DX II test results, the 5D Mark IV sensor will be a huge improvement over the 5D Mark III in terms of dynamic range - the ability to push the shadows (3 or 4 stops better). Also the ability to focus at f/8 using all points should significantly improve AF for those of us using teleconverters.

The 8MB resolution increase, GPS, Wifi, touchscreen, 4K video etc. are icing on the cake...I think it's a worthy upgrade from the 5D Mark III...Not sure I'm excited about the $3500 price tag, though...

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

ebiggs1 — Fri, 26 Aug 2016 13:00:31 GMT

"I had both of them and thought they weren't too bad at all. I don't see an overwhelming need to upgrade."

Me too! I could see the upgrade for the 24-405 because it was so old. But the 16-35 was done not too long ago. There is still going to be white box 'pull outs'. I assume, so there should be some good offerings available after it gets in full swing.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

Waddizzle — Fri, 26 Aug 2016 14:17:05 GMT

"The 8MB resolution increase, GPS, Wifi, touchscreen, 4K video etc. are icing on the cake...I think it's a worthy upgrade from the 5D Mark III...Not sure I'm excited about the $3500 price tag, though..."

The market demands that those features be included in at least one big ticket product. If there is a weather resistant 6D mark II [like a repackaged and relabeled 5D3], then that might be the camera to have moving forward.

Both lenses are old designs that have been on the market for around for close to 10 years, or more. But, I cannot complain about them. If the new versions are more rectilinear, then that would be a significant upgrade.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

RobertTheFat — Fri, 26 Aug 2016 15:49:24 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
"The 8MB resolution increase, GPS, Wifi, touchscreen, 4K video etc. are icing on the cake...I think it's a worthy upgrade from the 5D Mark III...Not sure I'm excited about the $3500 price tag, though..."

The market demands that those features be included in at least one big ticket product. If there is a weather resistant 6D mark II [like a repackaged and relabeled 5D3], then that might be the camera to have moving forward.

Both lenses are old designs that have been on the market for around for close to 10 years, or more. But, I cannot complain about them. If the new versions are more rectilinear, then that would be a significant upgrade.

I don't know what the reasoning was on the 24-105, but with the 16-35 I think it was that the f/2.8 Mk II wasn't good enough to outclass the much cheaper (and very sharp) f/4 version. One difficulty is that WA lenses don't have to be as fast as walkers and telephotos, because the indoor applications that need a WA (real estate photography, for example) are usually done with tripods and artificial light.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

diverhank — Fri, 26 Aug 2016 17:00:46 GMT

@ebiggs1 wrote:
"I had both of them and thought they weren't too bad at all. I don't see an overwhelming need to upgrade."

Me too! I could see the upgrade for the 24-405 because it was so old. But the 16-35 was done not too long ago. There is still going to be white box 'pull outs'. I assume, so there should be some good offerings available after it gets in full swing.

Considering the pricing of the camera + kit lens being more expensive than buying them separately, I'm not sure if there will be much white box pull outs...Maybe that will change with time .

@Robert The Fat wrote:

"I don't know what the reasoning was on the 24-105, but with the 16-35 I think it was that the f/2.8 Mk II wasn't good enough to outclass the much cheaper (and very sharp) f/4 version. One difficulty is that WA lenses don't have to be as fast as walkers and telephotos, because the indoor applications that need a WA (real estate photography, for example) are usually done with tripods and artificial light.."

Yeah, sometimes I wonder about the utility of f/2.8 on a wide angle lens myself. I have not yet used the f/2.8 on my 16-35mm lens except for testing. Having said that I think the "milky way" star gazer crowd really need the f/2.8 because they don't have enough light and can't afford too long of a shutter speed (otherwise it would have become a star trail shot).

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

ebiggs1 — Fri, 26 Aug 2016 18:27:00 GMT

B from B,

"...the f/2.8 Mk II wasn't good enough to outclass the much cheaper (and very sharp) f/4 version."

It is certainly sharper at f2.8, isn't it? I personally use the f2.8 quite a lot and I am glad as it matches the other two lenses I carry everywhere. Two things that are facts. One you never have enough focal length. Two, there is no such thing as too fast for a lens. No lens is so fast I can't stop it down!

For the time being your DPP is going to be the only software that supports dual-pixel raw. To take advantage of dual-pixel raw photographers will have to use Canon's raw-processing software, DPP. I still have never known a working pro that uses DPP. It is just too clumsy. I do have one of my retired buds that does use it since PS has gone cloud. He dabbled with it occasionally anyway.

I have no doubt Adobe will figure it out but I will bet the farm it will not be released for the perpetual LR crowd. Likely to be that last straw for completely going cloud.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

ebiggs1 — Fri, 26 Aug 2016 18:32:19 GMT

diverhank,

I do use f2.8 quite a lot so it means a lot to me. If I have a choice fo two nearly identical lenses but one is faster, I will choose the faster lens every time.

"I'm not sure if there will be much white box pull outs"

Lenses are great objects of admiration to us but to Canon they are a commodity. You are, however, correct as time will tell. It always does.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

Waddizzle — Sat, 27 Aug 2016 13:38:05 GMT

@ebiggs1 wrote:
diverhank,

I do use f2.8 quite a lot so it means a lot to me. If I have a choice fo two nearly identical lenses but one is faster, I will choose the faster lens every time.

"I'm not sure if there will be much white box pull outs"
Lenses are great objects of admiration to us but to Canon they are a commodity. You are, however, correct as time will tell. It always does.

I use f/2.8 on 16-35mm quite a lot, too. It is great for shooting indoors without a flash. In fact, I bought it just to take auto-focus pictures of my newborn grandaughter without a flash. It is really great outdoors, too, for capturing the sights like a tourist.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

diverhank — Sat, 27 Aug 2016 16:31:08 GMT

@Waddizzle wrote:
@ebiggs1 wrote:
diverhank,

I do use f2.8 quite a lot so it means a lot to me. If I have a choice fo two nearly identical lenses but one is faster, I will choose the faster lens every time.

I use f/2.8 on 16-35mm quite a lot, too. It is great for shooting indoors without a flash. In fact, I bought it just to take auto-focus pictures of my newborn grandaughter without a flash. It is really great outdoors, too, for capturing the sights like a tourist.

The reason I don't use f2.8 on this lens is because I only use it for landscape. For everything else, I use the 24-70mm f/2.8 II and I use 2.8 there often.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

Waddizzle — Sun, 28 Aug 2016 12:14:47 GMT

@diverhank wrote:
@Waddizzle wrote:
@ebiggs1 wrote:
diverhank,

I do use f2.8 quite a lot so it means a lot to me. If I have a choice fo two nearly identical lenses but one is faster, I will choose the faster lens every time.

I use f/2.8 on 16-35mm quite a lot, too. It is great for shooting indoors without a flash. In fact, I bought it just to take auto-focus pictures of my newborn grandaughter without a flash. It is really great outdoors, too, for capturing the sights like a tourist.
The reason I don't use f2.8 on this lens is because I only use it for landscape. For everything else, I use the 24-70mm f/2.8 II and I use 2.8 there often.

Just shot this today. 1D mark IV, EF 16-35mm f/2.8L II USM, 1/80, f/2.8, ISO 1600, no flash

New England Aircraft Museum, Bradley International Airport, near Hartford, Connecticut.

[EDIT] This hanger, one out of three, was nowhere near as brightly lit as the multitude of ceiling lights, and the photo, might suggest. These folks were trying to save money. As near as I can tell, the Exposure Value, is somewhere close to 5. Many areas of the hanger floors were lit up just a little better than dim.

Re: EOS 5D Mark IV Introduced

Davoud — Thu, 08 Sep 2016 20:10:00 GMT

"...desparate need of updating?" There probably isn't a product anywhere that can't be improved upon in some way, but "desperate need?" That's a bit melodramatic, isn't it? I never knew there was anything wrong with this lens. I've just re-examied some raw files made with my 5D Mk III and the 24-105 and I can't find anything wrong with the photos. Focus? Check. Color? Check. Sharpness? Check. So what should I be looking for?