topic Re: Football Blurry pics in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

Football Blurry pics

jdmcpherson — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 17:08:06 GMT

Hello from a newbie. I have a Canon Rebel T7i. I have been using my 75-300mm lens to capture my son’s high school football game. They are now a 7-0 team and are going to the playoffs, for sure. It’s my son’s senior year, so I don’t want any more lost shots to blur. I am struggling with capturing non-blurry action shots. I realize I need to get out of these auto programs into manual mode. The fields are well lit, as they have to be for football. I had a suggestion from another "fairly new to photgraphy" person of 1/400 on the shutter speed (this camera’s range is from 30 to 1/4000). That seems slow to me, given that the range is so vast. Should it be quicker? I also had the suggestion of the aperture at 8? Does that sound right? I am having difficulties trying to decide leaving ISO on auto or setting it. Any suggestions?

Re: Football Blurry pics

Waddizzle — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 17:34:46 GMT

Just because a high school football field may look well lit your eyes, that does not mean the camera shares that opinion. Shooting night time sports is something professional photographers struggle with using gear that costs 10x what yours does.

The EF 75-300mm series of Canon lenses are not one of Canon's best efforts. They are designed more for teaching you about DSLRS, than they are for capturing high quality images. I would replace this with a better lens. Next to you, this is the weakest link in your work flow. Sorry, but this experience you're going through is one you will learn from. No offense intended.

The next weak link in your work flow could be your shooting location. Shooting from the bleachers is never good, not unless you have a lens as long as your arm. Getting closer to the action is better, even if it means shooting from the sideline between the 10 yard line and the back of the end zone.

Back to problem number one, the lens. In addition to not being the sharpest lens in the bag, the 75-300mm is not one of the fastest lenses in the bag. Fast lenses have aperture ranges of f/2.8, or faster. The 75-300mm is f/5.6 at the long end of the zoom range, 300mm, which is probably close to where you're taking most of your shots...I assume.

The automatic Sports mode in the camera can do a decent job in bright sunshine. But, it struggles even more than pro photographers during night time sports. The aperture range, f/3.5-5.6m of the EF 75-300mm lens is most of the problem. Getting out of Sports mode will improve your results when shooting at night, but you will still be hindered by the current lens.

There are a few new lens choices, all of which depend upon your budget. The most expensive investments a photographer makes are in the lenses, not the camera body. You should figure on spending $500 to $1000 USD for a better lens.

Seeing how you are just a hobbyist, I am going to recommend that you visit KEH dot COM, Type "Canon EF 70-200mm" in the search box. I saw a very attractive looking EF 70-200mm f/4L IS USM lens in "EX" for excellent condition. Order it today, and you may have it by the weekend. Or, you.could visit a Canon authorized dealer and spend twice that amount for a new one. KEH will give you a 6 month guarantee, which is not exact;y the same as a 6 month warranty.

Re: Football Blurry pics

wq9nsc — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 17:52:29 GMT

Night football at high school is tough because even a field that looks well lighted to a fan isn't well illuminated from the camera's point of view.

1/500 is about the minimum to get non-blurry action shots and quite a bit of motion blur will still be present in many, 1/640 is better and that is where I shoot most high school games except for the rare exception with better lighting that allows SLIGHTLY higher shutter speed.

HOWEVER, I am shooting with f2.8 maximum aperture lenses and you are going to quickly run into an exposure triangle issue using slower (f4 or larger number aperture) while trying to keep shutter speed at a sufficient level without ISO going so far that shots are extremely noisy or even beyond your camera's available ISO range.

Ignore whoever gave you the advice to shoot at f8 unless you are taking posed group shots, for night football action you need you lens set as wide open as it will go (lowest f number).

Realistically, getting good action shots at night requires a good location and a fast lens. My standard setup for night field sports at high school is manual exposure, wide open aperture (f2.8 with the glass I use), shutter speed 1/640, and ISO set to auto. With slower glass you will have to drop to 1/500 or lower and once you get below 1/500 there is going to be a lot more motion blur. To help your AF system work faster, choose a single focus point in the center of the screen.

This photo is from the best illuminated HS field I shot at in Fall 2019 and it still required ISO in the 3200-6400 range to stay at 1/640 shooting with an EF 300 f2.8 lens on a 1DX Mark II from the sidelines. Even with the excellent high ISO noise performance of my 1DX II and 1DX III, the difference between a f2.8 and f4 lens is very significant and the difference will be huge on a lower cost body.

Rodger

Re: Football Blurry pics

jdmcpherson — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 18:17:11 GMT

I would not take offense to any suggestions and experience shared! I am appreciative of your time.

I have been taking pictures in the No-Flash mode since sport at night isn't great, as you mentioned. I have been pretty successful in getting most shots, except those fast action shots. I stand at the fence between the bleechers and the field, walking back and forth along the sidelines at the fense for pictures.

The lighting in the pictures from the field have been pretty decent. I was really surprised. I learned right away not to use flash and not to have it on sport once the light starts to go.

I am taking most of my shots between 100 and 225mm. Maybe 1/6th of my pics are at 300mm.

Could I ask you what you thought of entering manual with a shutter speed of 1/400 vs say 1/1000? I take from your reply that I should set my aperture as low as possible, letting in the most light? The lowest I can go isf4.0. And should I leave my ISO on auto at the same time?

THANK YOU for the website suggestion! I have that lens in my cart already! I just need to talk to the hubs about buying it, as it exceeds our pre-agreed "talk-about" amount.

Most sincerely,

Jennifer

Re: Football Blurry pics

jdmcpherson — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 18:52:23 GMT

Rodger, thank you so much for your response! What you say makes sense! If I am understanding correctly, the higher the shutter speed, the more light it requires. I accept that I will be doing some experimenting this Friday night! I will start at the lowest aperature (f4.0) , ISO on auto, and the shutter speed at 1/650 and plan to adjust down to 1/500 and 1/400 as I see what is coming through. Thank you for the starting point recommendations!

Jennifer

I love your picture!

Here is an example of my picture image issue. This is on the EF 75-300mm on the No-flash mode. I don't know how to tell what the settings are in that mode. I guess I should pull my camera's manual and find out! This picture is what is spurring me to do better. I will buy what I need to do it! Thanks again!

Re: Football Blurry pics

Waddizzle — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 18:38:01 GMT

@jdmcpherson wrote:
Rodger, thank you so much for your response! What you say makes sense! If I am understanding correctly, the higher the shutter speed, the more light it requires. I accept that I will be doing some experimenting this Friday night! I will start at the lowest aperature (f4.0) , ISO on auto, and the shutter speed at 1/650 and plan to adjust down to 1/500 and 1/400 as I see what is coming through. Thank you for the starting point recommendations!

Jennifer

Why wait until Friday night? You can figure out the camera settings day or night. You can practice shooting at night by aiming at something under a street light.

You will discover that your lens does not have a constant minimum aperture setting throughout the entire zoom range. At the short end it will f/3.5. As you zoom out, it will quickly shoot up to f/5.6.

I suggest that you get out of Automatic Sport shooting mode, too. You may wish to try to M mode, with ISO set to Auto. With this setting, you will want to go into your camera menu and set an upper limit for ISO Auto. I suggest ISO 3200. ISO 1600 would be better, but your lens does not have a wide aperture. Your ISO will be pushing 3200 to 12800.

Re: Football Blurry pics

jdmcpherson — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 18:58:41 GMT

Great Suggestions, I will definitely be looking at my settings as you suggest! Yeah, I stopped using Sport mode about 5 games ago when it started getting darker sooner. I've been shooting in no-flash mode instead. But I am gaining so much knowledge reading and through the forum. I'll experiment this eveing. We leave in very rural Montana, so I may have to drive bit to see if I can get some cars to drive under a light for action shots, lol.

I am very thankful for the tips!!

~Jenniferf

Re: Football Blurry pics

Waddizzle — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 21:26:47 GMT

@jdmcpherson wrote:
Great Suggestions, I will definitely be looking at my settings as you suggest! Yeah, I stopped using Sport mode about 5 games ago when it started getting darker sooner. I've been shooting in no-flash mode instead. But I am gaining so much knowledge reading and through the forum. I'll experiment this eveing. We leave in very rural Montana, so I may have to drive bit to see if I can get some cars to drive under a light for action shots, lol.

I am very thankful for the tips!!

~Jenniferf

I don't know what it is like in rural Montana, but here in the East the power company will install one light pole on or near the main entrance to your property. If not, I would assume that you have at least one outdoor light on your property, or on hour home.

You can pracice shooting still photos as RAW after sunset, and then processing them into JPG files using the Canon app. This is something you may want to learn together with the star of the show himself.

You can also experiment with metering modes. When I have shot night time sports, the backgrounds are usually very dark, compared to the players on the field in the foreground. I will set the camera to Center-Weighted Averge metering mode, so that the camera looks primarily at the center of the viewfinder to set exposure. If the camera sees the surrounding dark background, it will try to raise ISO as much as full stop higher than what I might really need.

Re: Football Blurry pics

Waddizzle — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 21:29:47 GMT

I suggest that you take a look at the Series of Beginner Videos, EOS 101, on the Canon USA Youtube channel. The link is in the very first post in this thread.

https://community.usa.canon.com/t5/General-Camera-Discussion/Canon-YouTube-Video-Series/m-p/269237#M7640

Re: Football Blurry pics

jdmcpherson — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 21:31:07 GMT

Thank you! I'll do that.

Re: Football Blurry pics

jrhoffman75 — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 00:55:30 GMT

Hi Jennifer.

I will post my screenshot first and then talk about it.

Your exposure triangle values show that you are definitely light limited.

f/4.5 is the maximum lens opening your current lens can provide.

While your camera can go higher than ISO 6400 quality really starts to fall off.

With those two settings (I can't tell from the metadata what mode your camera was in) the camera selected a shutter speed of 1/1/25 - too slow for what you want to do. It's even to slow for handholding your lens at 135mm.

You also have the camera set on AI Focus. That is an automatic sensing mode where the camera evaluates an image and decides whether to set One Shot AF or AI Servo. AI Servo is a mode where tghe camera will measure the speed of an object approaching the camera and do some math to adjust focus so that the image is in focus when the shutter fires.

I forgot to highlight this, but the camera is also on automatic AF point selection.

I suggest you try the following settings. If you don't have the manual you can download a PDF from the Canon website.

1. select a single center focus point.

2. set the camera to Tv mode and set 1/640 as discussed above. This will lock the shutter speed at 1/640.

3. set Auto ISO

4. set One Shot AF - put the red square on your son

With these settings the camera will maximize the lens opening first, and then, depending on the lighting conditions, start increasing ISO. You may get a noisy image, but that is preferable to a fuzzy image. As Rodger said, you can try lowering Tv to 1/500 and see how that works. If you get a sharp image then you will have the benefit of lower ISO - lower digital noise.

Another option would be full manual with aperture at f/4, but given the low lighting levels you will be at max anyway and Tv gives you one less thing to worry about setting if you happen to change lenses.

The T7i is a very capable camera, and the 70-200 f/4L that Waddizzle recommended is an outstanding lens. One step down from the f/2.8L version you will frequently see on NFL sidelines.

Re: Football Blurry pics

Waddizzle — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 09:25:29 GMT

The AI Focus mode setting is a direct result of selecting the "No Flash" automatic shooting mode. This is locked into the camera's behavior. Using one of the Creative Shooting modes , P, Tv, Av, or M, would allow the user to select a better AF mode, like One Shot or AI Servo.

The biggest problem that i see with sample photo is motion blur in the subjects, which is due to the relatively slow shutter speed for action photography. Your sample also shows an f/4.5 aperture. If you had a faster lens, f/2.8 or faster, you could have easily doubled your shutter speed, which have helped to significantly reduce the amount of subject motion blur.

Photographing Friday Night Lights is a pretty demaniding challenge. I see that your focal length is under 200mm, which would suggest that a 70-200mm f/2.8 lens might be beneficial. In fact, any lens with a maximum aperture of f/2.8 or faster would take a lot of the bite out of the challlenge of night time sports photography.

Re: Football Blurry pics

jdmcpherson — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 14:03:18 GMT

Good morning, John.

WOW! I am astounded! I did not know that the pictures could provide so much detail. I am assuming (still new at this) that that information in stored in file's properties? May I ask how one gets to that information? Is it a program?

I really appreciate the information you provided and the suggestions as well.

Thank you!!

~Jennifer

Honestly, everyone, I am so appreciative of all the feedback and suggestions!

Re: Football Blurry pics

jdmcpherson — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 14:06:53 GMT

Good morning, Waddizzle.

I am definitely getting the faster lens! Thank you for all your help and guidance. 🙂

~Jennifer

Re: Football Blurry pics

jrhoffman75 — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 14:09:25 GMT

Good morning Jennifer.

It's all available, along with editing capability, using the free Canon Digital Photo Professional.

https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/support/details/cameras/eos-dslr-and-mirrorless-cameras/dslr/eos-rebel-t7i-body/eos-rebel-t7i?tab=drivers_downloads

Re: Football Blurry pics

jdmcpherson — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 14:18:28 GMT

AWESOME!! THANK YOU!!!

~Jennifer

Re: Football Blurry pics

jrhoffman75 — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 14:29:42 GMT

You're welcome.

I noticed the image you posted was a JPEG.

To get the best results when processing your images, especially the nightime images where you will most likely be needing some noise reduction, I recommend you shoot RAW. DPP and most other editing software seamlessly import the RAW images.

If you want images for quick emailing or sharing you could shoot RAW plus JPEG.

THis is based on an earlier version of DPP, but the basics are the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kIqd1OTcWLQ&list=PLCD7AA7E58615DDBB&index=1

What software are you currently using?

Re: Football Blurry pics

jdmcpherson — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 14:45:13 GMT

I copy my images to a file and when I want to crop or adjust, I just use the edit options in Photos. I will look in my manual for RAW. I've only heard of it in this thread. I have A LOT to learn!

Thanks again!

~Jennifer

Re: Football Blurry pics

shadowsports — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 15:19:45 GMT

Jennifer,

Credit to Wadizzle, jrhoffman75 and wq9nsc...

These guys are real pros, and rodger always has the best footbal pics.

The data you asked about is called EXIF data and is embedded in each photograph.

I suggest you install Canon's DPP (Digital Photo Professiional) which can display this infor for you. Its free.

https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/portal/us/home/support/details/cameras/eos-dslr-and-mirrorless-cameras/dslr/eos-rebel-t7i-body/eos-rebel-t7i?tab=drivers_downloads

EDIT - Guys beat me to it...

Re: Football Blurry pics

ebiggs1 — Mon, 12 Oct 2020 16:14:53 GMT

" I have a Canon Rebel T7i. I have been using my 75-300mm lens ..."

I didn't read thoroughly all the posts up to now but I did glance at them. Most of what was said is valid but some is not, IMHO, of course. Some of what I am going to suggest might have already been said so bear with me.

The three most important things in sports photography is location, location and location. Yes, it is where you shoot from. Along with this comes knowledge of the game or sport. You need to know how football is played. Shooting from the bleachers for instance or being on the opposite side of the field when the action is at the other goal line will result in failure. Even if you have the best gear in the world. You have to know the sport. You have to anticipate what is going to happen. Can you shoot from the side lines? That is best.

Your lens is considered to be a slow lens. It is f4 only at 75mm. It is not f4 even at 76mm as it starts its slide down to f5.6. So, a faster lens is a good idea. I read where someone suggested you use Tv mode. That is wrong because we already know the lens is the weak link here. You need to use Av mode and set the lens to its widest aperture. Then the camera can select the fastest SS possible. Why is it this way? Because that lens will be at its widest aperture most likely all the time anyway. I also would select a high fixed ISO number. Try a high as you can get decent photos, say 1600 or even 3200.

You need to set One shot and just the center focus point. Turn all the others off. You need to use Raw file format never jpg. You need a good post editor. Canon has a free one called DPP4. You can d/l it from the Canon web site. Most of the conversion form Raw to jpg will be automatic. However using Raw you will have a greater deal of adjustment possible.

What I have suggested will get you the best possible results from what you have. I have taught it to many Moms and dads over the years. You will not get every shot. Nobody does, not even the best of the best out there gets every shot.