topic Re: 70d or 6d in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

70d or 6d

pmforester — Mon, 04 Aug 2014 21:16:24 GMT

I have read tons of posts here and across the net. I currently have an SL1 with an array of lenses both EF and EFS with a couple of L's. I would like to add another camera to my bag and I'm considering one of the above. Movies are not a priority. I take travel, landscape and wildlife photography. Which would be a better addition to my bag? I'm also torn if waiting 6 months to save for a 5dM3 would be worth the effort.

Thanks for the help.

Re: 70d or 6d

Skirball — Mon, 04 Aug 2014 21:41:41 GMT

According to the internet the 6D can't focus on anything that moves, and the 70D can't focus on anything at all, unless you use liveview. Pick your poison.

I own a 6D and love it. Fit's my needs as a photographer just fine; spectacular in low light, small size for a FF, recovery is amazing. The AF system has some limitations, but I work around it without issue. But I don't shoot sports.

If you want low light performance get a 6D. If it's not particularly important to you get a 70D. If you want low light performance with a great AF system wait for the 5d3.

Re: 70d or 6d

RobertTheFat — Wed, 06 Aug 2014 11:06:17 GMT

@Skirball wrote:
According to the internet the 6D can't focus on anything that moves, and the 70D can't focus on anything at all, unless you use liveview. Pick your poison.

I own a 6D and love it. Fit's my needs as a photographer just fine; spectacular in low light, small size for a FF, recovery is amazing. The AF system has some limitations, but I work around it without issue. But I don't shoot sports.

If you want low light performance get a 6D. If it's not particularly important to you get a 70D. If you want low light performance with a great AF system wait for the 5d3.

And if you want to use all your lenses, as well as opt out of the 6D/70D autofocus whining, get a 7D.

Re: 70d or 6d

ebiggs1 — Tue, 05 Aug 2014 13:43:38 GMT

+1 on the 7D.

Re: 70d or 6d

cale_kat — Tue, 05 Aug 2014 15:22:08 GMT

The 7D is widely rumored to be replaced by a new, updated model in the coming months. The existing model is deeply discounted ($500 off) and a extremely good value. OTOH, when the updated model arrives it will bring with in changes that are worth knowing about before the OP buys. I'd hold off on the 7D purchase until at least after Photokina, a big industry trade in September.

The 70D is not a particularly good choice if you are NOT going to be shooting movies. The big value of dual-pixel autofocus technology is to improve live view and its ability to track focus while filming.

The 6D is an excellent choice for an advanced photographer. You will not be able to use your EF-S lenses and you will give up the longer DOF of the APS-C sensor, the generally lighter weight of EF-S lenses, and the "magnification" a smaller sensor offers in like-size prints. You will gain more creative control using shallow DOF with the larger sensor in the 6D.

Re: 70d or 6d

Skirball — Tue, 05 Aug 2014 15:48:07 GMT

The new 7D, whenever it finally comes out, is most likely going to be in a whole new price category than the previous; much like they did with the 5d3.

OP: unless by "Wildlife" you mean shooting birds, there's little advantage in getting a 7D. It offers very little over your SL1 for anything static or slowly moving. Image quality and low light performance is about the same. I'm not sure if you're looking for a backup camera or an upgrade. But if you're going to upgrade you might as well make it a significant step.

Re: 70d or 6d

TCampbell — Tue, 05 Aug 2014 16:01:55 GMT

A 7D would be a top performer for "action" photography... followed by the 70D.

The 6D will be a top performer in low light shooting high ISO with low noise.

The 6D cannot use "EF-S" lenses.

One (possibly annoying) feature of the 6D is that the GPS, if enabled, is drawing power at all times (including when the camera is powered off and put away.) You either have to go into the menu system and disable the GPS before powering the camera off, or you can remove the battery from the camera after powering off.

If you fail to do one or the other the camera will most likely have a completely dead battery the next time you use it (it would be a good idea to pick up a spare battery.)

This is because the power switch on these cameras (pretty much any modern camera) is just a soft switch. Canon indicates that they do this because a GPS takes a minute or two to get a position fix. They don't want a situation where you're out shooting for the day, you switch off your camera... suddenly you see something interesting and switch it on... but since the GPS wouldn't have had time to get a fix, the images would have no GPS data (the camera can shoot immediately... you just don't get GPS data.) So... they leave the GPS on.

Re: 70d or 6d

cale_kat — Tue, 05 Aug 2014 16:38:17 GMT

@Skirball wrote:
The new 7D, whenever it finally comes out, is most likely going to be in a whole new price category than the previous; much like they did with the 5d3.

Okay, but by "whenever it finally comes out" do you mean to suggest it is not imminent? Because there is every reason to believe that a successor is in the wings.

In 2005, the 5D was released with a body-only price of $3,299. In 2009, the 5D Mark II was release with a body-only price of $2,699. Obviously, "most likely" is not certain as Canon has dropped the price of updated bodies in the past.

The bottom line is that the market sets the prices. The market for cameras looks a lot different in 2014 than it did when the 7D was released in 2009.

OP: unless by "Wildlife" you mean shooting birds, there's little advantage in getting a 7D. It offers very little over your SL1 for anything static or slowly moving. Image quality and low light performance is about the same. I'm not sure if you're looking for a backup camera or an upgrade. But if you're going to upgrade you might as well make it a significant step.

Offen overlooked, but important to keep in mind are the following:

* Camera balance. The 7D weighs 810 grams and the SL1 weighs 407 grams, half as much. Typically longer lenses balance better on heavier bodies. Camera balance aids control and lessens fatigue.

* Parts, Options and Support. The 7D enjoys much wider support from the online community as well as much deeper support for accessories, etc. It has been an extremely popular camera especially among camera enthusiasts.

Re: 70d or 6d

cale_kat — Wed, 06 Aug 2014 05:13:55 GMT

Just checked the prices on refurbished 7Ds at the Canon store. Priced at $839 and change, the 7D is a very good value especially considering that low shutter counts and a 1 year warranty are the hallmarks of Canon shop value. If my experience buying the 5d2 refurbished last year is any indication, these prices will hold for a few months.

Linky http://shop.usa.canon.com/shop/en/catalog/cameras/refurbished-eos-digital-slr-cameras/eos-7d-body-refurbished

Put differently... the refurbished 6D body is priced at $1,519.20 (if available which it currently isn't) and considering the advanced autofocus system on the 7D, one would have to choose carefully. If your interest were primarily outdoor athletics and/or wildlife shooting, the 7D is the easy choice considering availability and pricing.

Re: 70d or 6d

Skirball — Wed, 06 Aug 2014 15:27:11 GMT

@cale_kat wrote:
@Skirball wrote:
The new 7D, whenever it finally comes out, is most likely going to be in a whole new price category than the previous; much like they did with the 5d3.

Okay, but by "whenever it finally comes out" do you mean to suggest it is not imminent? Because there is every reason to believe that a successor is in the wings.

I guess that depends on your definition of imminent. Will Canon finally officially announce that they will be releasing a 7D2 in a month and a half? Yeah, probably. If I was deciding between two cameras that have nothing to do with the 7D in the first place, would I wait for the announcement, to then wait for the release, to then pay the inflated introductory cost for a camera that I wasn't really looking at purchasing in the first place? No.

@cale_kat wrote:

Offen overlooked, but important to keep in mind are the following:

* Camera balance. The 7D weighs 810 grams and the SL1 weighs 407 grams, half as much. Typically longer lenses balance better on heavier bodies. Camera balance aids control and lessens fatigue.

* Parts, Options and Support. The 7D enjoys much wider support from the online community as well as much deeper support for accessories, etc. It has been an extremely popular camera especially among camera enthusiasts.

Camera weight? That's completely subjective. Some people like light cameras. Your argument for balance on long lenses is just as applicable to an SL1 with a small fast prime.

Parts and support? Please. How many people are out there repairing their own cameras with parts they bought? How much support do you need to operate a camera? Accessories? Are you referring to these 'photo enthusiasts" with their custom straps, eye pieces, LCD covers, bubble levels and the like. Those guys always crack me up.

Re: 70d or 6d

Skirball — Wed, 06 Aug 2014 15:34:08 GMT

@cale_kat wrote:
Put differently... the refurbished 6D body is priced at $1,519.20 (if available which it currently isn't) and considering the advanced autofocus system on the 7D, one would have to choose carefully. If your interest were primarily outdoor athletics and/or wildlife shooting, the 7D is the easy choice considering availability and pricing.

You can get a brand new 6D for $1600. Even cheaper than that if you're willing to go to grey market (not that I am).

Regardless - I haven't followed these potential AF issues with the 70D. But if I did and could convince myself that there isn't a problem, I'd much rather spend a little more for a new 70D than a refurbished 7D. It can do just about everything the 7D can do, and many things it can't. My point simply that it isn't an easy choice, different people have different needs.

Re: 70d or 6d

cale_kat — Wed, 06 Aug 2014 18:43:06 GMT

@Skirball wrote:
@cale_kat wrote:
@Skirball wrote:
The new 7D, whenever it finally comes out, is most likely going to be in a whole new price category than the previous; much like they did with the 5d3.

Okay, but by "whenever it finally comes out" do you mean to suggest it is not imminent? Because there is every reason to believe that a successor is in the wings.
I guess that depends on your definition of imminent. Will Canon finally officially announce that they will be releasing a 7D2 in a month and a half? Yeah, probably. If I was deciding between two cameras that have nothing to do with the 7D in the first place, would I wait for the announcement, to then wait for the release, to then pay the inflated introductory cost for a camera that I wasn't really looking at purchasing in the first place? No.

Hey, what you would do is entirely up to you... I'm just offering the OP, who admittedly does NOT place a priority on movies, some perspective regarding a better choice for still photography. If you want to advise the OP to buy a 70D, that's your opinion.

"Pay the inflated introductory cost..." Guess we'll have to wait and see. If you know the cost, I'm all ears.

@cale_kat wrote:

Offen overlooked, but important to keep in mind are the following:

* Camera balance. The 7D weighs 810 grams and the SL1 weighs 407 grams, half as much. Typically longer lenses balance better on heavier bodies. Camera balance aids control and lessens fatigue.

* Parts, Options and Support. The 7D enjoys much wider support from the online community as well as much deeper support for accessories, etc. It has been an extremely popular camera especially among camera enthusiasts.

Camera weight? That's completely subjective. Some people like light cameras. Your argument for balance on long lenses is just as applicable to an SL1 with a small fast prime.

I disagree. You are suggesting that where the heavy weight is doesn't matter. But it does. It matters more if the weight is in the front because it upsets balance.

Parts and support? Please. How many people are out there repairing their own cameras with parts they bought? How much support do you need to operate a camera? Accessories? Are you referring to these 'photo enthusiasts" with their custom straps, eye pieces, LCD covers, bubble levels and the like. Those guys always crack me up.

You don't get it... I won't try.

Re: 70d or 6d

Skirball — Wed, 06 Aug 2014 21:44:06 GMT

@cale_kat wrote:
"Pay the inflated introductory cost..." Guess we'll have to wait and see. If you know the cost, I'm all ears.

You seem to miss the point (frequently). The introductory cost is always higher than the price it settles into after several months, especially on camera bodies. I don't care to pay this "fee", though obviously some don't mind it. But I factor this into consideration for purchases. If I was interested in a 7D2 then I would know I would have to wait a month and a half for Canon to potentially announce it, then probably a month or two more before it was actually released, and then another 3 - months before the price settled. Suddenly I'm at upwards of a year out... hence I don't shop for equipment that doesn't even exist yet.

cale_kat wrote

I disagree. You are suggesting that where the heavy weight is doesn't matter. But it does. It matters more if the weight is in the front because it upsets balance.

I said nothing of the sort. I implied that weight is a subjective "attribute", and balance is relative to the size/weight of the lens.

@cale_kat wrote:
@Skirball wrote:
Parts and support? Please. How many people are out there repairing their own cameras with parts they bought? How much support do you need to operate a camera? Accessories? Are you referring to these 'photo enthusiasts" with their custom straps, eye pieces, LCD covers, bubble levels and the like. Those guys always crack me up.

You don't get it... I won't try.

Lol. I guess you're one of the accessorizing types.

Re: 70d or 6d

cale_kat — Wed, 06 Aug 2014 22:56:09 GMT

@Skirball wrote:
@cale_kat wrote:
"Pay the inflated introductory cost..." Guess we'll have to wait and see. If you know the cost, I'm all ears.

You seem to miss the point (frequently). Ha ha. The introductory cost is always higher than the price it settles into after several months, especially on camera bodies. I don't care to pay this "fee", though obviously some don't mind it. But I factor this into consideration for purchases. If I was interested in a 7D2 then I would know I would have to wait a month and a half for Canon to potentially announce it, then probably a month or two more before it was actually released, and then another 3 - months before the price settled. Suddenly I'm at upwards of a year out... hence I don't shop for equipment that doesn't even exist yet. (We could just agree to disagree on the subject of timing for the release of the 7D.)

I know that the cost will "settle in". For someone shopping for a second body, I don't know what the hurry is. Especially as the OP is considering a top-notch camera, like the 70D or the 6D. I just seems to me that the more information he has (including about any products "just around the corner" introductory-wise) before he buys, the more satisfied he is likely to be.

The OP said he might not buy for 6 months, so I advise taking some time to see what's out in a couple month's time. At least then he will know what he could have bought.

I hear you when you say that the cost can and usually goes down. But I also read in the OP's post that he might consider a 5D3 in 6 month's time if the price comes down. I presume he means that the imminent introduction of the 5D4 will cause the price of the existing model to drop. This certainly is the case with the 7D2 causing the 7D to come down.

If the OP might send $3k on a 5D3, don't you think he might spend $2K on a 7D2? His budget seems pretty fluid to me and I don't have any idea what the new 7D will bring but the bets are favoring a new sensor which in itself would be exciting.
cale_kat wrote
I disagree. You are suggesting that where the heavy weight is doesn't matter. But it does. It matters more if the weight is in the front because it upsets balance.
I said nothing of the sort. I implied that weight is a subjective "attribute", and balance is relative to the size/weight of the lens.

Sorry, no offense was meant. My comment regarding the balance of a longer lens on a heavier body seems pretty innocuous. I wouldn't be the first to note that the size of the camera grip can make a significant difference in the overall ergonomics of the camera. Ergonomics, how something is handled, may be a subjective "attribute" but it is widely accepted as a consideration when evaluating a camera body.

@cale_kat wrote:
@Skirball wrote:
Parts and support? Please. How many people are out there repairing their own cameras with parts they bought? How much support do you need to operate a camera? Accessories? Are you referring to these 'photo enthusiasts" with their custom straps, eye pieces, LCD covers, bubble levels and the like. Those guys always crack me up.

You don't get it... I won't try.
Lol. I guess you're one of the accessorizing types.

Huh? Now I get to say, "I never said anything of the sort?" 🙂