topic Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50 in EOS DSLR & Mirrorless Cameras

EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

kingsahibkhan — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 20:29:33 GMT

Hey i realized that a lot of my RP photos arent as sharp as my M50 at further distances and a lot of times my RP photos are blurry and i never experienced the same with my M50.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1ggc239v1EpPc3rZ9zn2lJ78--hZNbHOf?usp=sharing

The picture at the pier was with RF lenses and as you can see it cannot focus well at all. The other pictures are with a EF 50mm. The clarity of the walking person in with the m50 is just far higher than the people in the RP photo. Please take a look and see if you agree. (zooming in makes the biggest difference.)

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

deebatman316 — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 20:49:21 GMT

The picture with the pier the camera did focus on something. It didn't focus on the people you would have to zoom in more to get them in focus. A camera can only focus on one spot not multiple. Using a different F/ stop for instance moving from F/4 to F/11 would yield more things in the background to be in focus. The camera will always focus on something that is closer to it than further away. Also if it has more contrast it will do the same thing.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

Tronhard — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 21:56:34 GMT

To add to the comments that Demetrius has made about focus - using the default matrix focus will simply let the camera focus on what has the clearest contrast and what is closest. In a cluttered image it is much more effective to use single point or expanded centre focus. That way you point the centre of the field of view at the point you want in focus and the camera will concentrate on that. However, the challenge then if you are using the shutter button to focus, moving the camera to compose may well get the focus point to move. That is why so many photographers use Back Button focus, with centred spot focus and Servo.

See the following video from Canon on this subject:

Another thing I am picking up is that the images from the RP are generally blurrier than those of the M50, but looking at the details in DPP4 at how the images were shot, it appears you are shooting in live view mode, is that correct - i.e. you are shooting by looking at the back LCD rather than via the EVF?

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

kingsahibkhan — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 23:07:37 GMT

Yes i use the LCD more often, and i did the same for the M50. I generally do not have camera movement issues if shooting faster than 1/80 on the shutter. The focus issue with the RP comes up even when the focus is on singular point and focuses right on the subject. I usually delete all the bad photos so i dont have an example to show you but its a constant focus issue when shooting at a distance.

On the m50 if i used the 50mm and singular point focus to shoot a subject thats 10 meters away there are no issues with the sharpness of the subject but if i do the same with the RP it does not focus well and become blurry.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

Tronhard — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 23:12:23 GMT

To expand on my last comment. While the R50 with a short FL lens is very light and may tolerate being used by looking at the LCD, the RP is much heavier and the potential for camera shake is magnified by the focal length. For that reason, conventional wisdom encourages you to use the electronic viewfinder instead of the LCD for composing and shooting. That is because you get three points of support: the two elbows tucked tight to the sides of the torso, and the camera pressed against the face - thus forming a sort of tripod. See this example of how to use a larger camera:
The correct techniques

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

deebatman316 — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 23:19:32 GMT

The OP has the EOS M50 not the EOS R50. So that camera is much smaller than the RP.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

Tronhard — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 23:22:57 GMT

My examination of the images in DPP4 and Photoshop really show that there is consistent camera movement - it's not just my opinion, I consulted with Demetrius and he shares the same opinion. You definitely have camera shake as well as some focusing issues, so it's up to you if you want to take the advice about using the EVF.

One sees a lot of images on social media and You Tube of people shooting via the LCD, but usually they are shooting with cameras using very short FL lenses and they are using lenses with image stabilization, and many cameras have IBIS as well, to mitigate that camera shake. Your 50mm has no IS and its own weight is exacerbated by the EF-RF adapter required, apart from the weight of the camera itself. With the RF 24-105, while it has IS (is it enabled?) that is not a guarantee of steadiness with shooting - that IS is designed assuming one is holding it as steadily as possible, it's not a panacea.

As to the focus itself, I would definitely suggest exploring the use of the more limited focus points - this gives you the most control of what the camera is going to focus on. Most fellow professionals I know will use single point focus and BBF to control.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

kingsahibkhan — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 23:25:53 GMT

I did singular point on a building and even that building came out blurry, im going to see if i can take more photos as examples tomorrow.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

Tronhard — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 23:34:28 GMT

I think that is a good idea. Can you humor us by taking some using the LCD and some using the EVF with the hand and arm placement as shown? Technique is far easier and cheaper to fix than gear issues.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

deebatman316 — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 23:39:26 GMT

The problem here is that Full Frame cameras have shallower depth of field than their APS-C counterparts. Shooting at very wide open apertures on Full Frame will show this more. Shooting at F/2 for instance on APS-C camera will have more things in focus than shooting at F/2 on a Full Frame camera. Also the image sensor in an APS-C camera causes a 1.6x focal length increase. The lens will always be a 50mm lens but the angle of view changes depending on the sensor size. Note both of these pictures below were both taken with the EF 50mm F/1.8 STM lens. But one picture was taken on an APS-C camera the other was take with a Full Frame camera. The picture on the top was taken with the EOS 40D an APS-C camera. The picture on the bottom was taken with the EOS 5D Mark IV a Full Frame camera. Both pictures were taken at an aperture of F/1.8. Notice the picture on the bottom has more bokeh (background) then the one at the top.

Gear: EOS 40D, EF 50mm F/1.8 STM Settings: Tv 1/1000th sec, AV F/1.8, ISO 100

Gear: EOS 5D Mark IV (Full Frame), EF 50mm F/1.8 STM Settings: Tv 1/320th sec, AV F/1.8, ISO 100

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

deebatman316 — Wed, 25 Sep 2024 23:51:41 GMT

What AF Zones are you using?
What focus mode are you using One Shot, Servo AF or AI Focus?
What mode is the top mode dial set to?

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

Tronhard — Thu, 26 Sep 2024 00:03:51 GMT

Absolutely Demetrius - it is both smaller and lighter, and the lens configurations are lighter too.

To give you an idea of how important technique is, I will give the example of this image, taken with the Sigma 150-600c lens, hand-held, using the Canon EOS 5DIV, also a 30MP camera and with no IBIS.
This is the original image:
EOS 5DIV, Sigma 150-600@520mm, f/8, 1/1000sec, ISO-200 The same image, cropped

Using the EOS M5, essentially the same as your M50 but configured more for stills also hand-held, and using a slow shutter speed
EOS M5, EF-M 18-150@59mm, f/6.3, 1/40sec, ISO-200

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

Tronhard — Thu, 26 Sep 2024 00:21:15 GMT

From looking at DPP4, the mode is M, low speed continuous, Servo

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

deebatman316 — Thu, 26 Sep 2024 00:21:44 GMT

Yes technique is very important and it will lead to very sharp pictures. Improper settings and techniques will lead to out of focus pictures.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

deebatman316 — Thu, 26 Sep 2024 00:24:34 GMT

One Shot would be a better in this situation vs Servo AF. The subjects are stationary and not moving.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

Tronhard — Thu, 26 Sep 2024 00:26:39 GMT

The OP has the EOS M50 not the EOS R50. So that camera is much smaller than the RP.

Exactly my point, there is a lot more weight and leverage with a FF camera and a zoom on a telephoto setting compared to a fixed, light lens with short FL on a small, light body. The M50 was really designed for vloggers, so it lends itself to being used via the LCD as well as EVF.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

deebatman316 — Thu, 26 Sep 2024 00:36:23 GMT

The EOS M Series was really designed for content creators. So the lenses were small and compact to begin with. Generally you'll see more camera shake with telephoto lenses or a lens set to a telephoto setting such as 85mm. Most lenses in the telephoto range have IS to counteract camera shake. With newer cameras with IBIS will stabilize all lenses now. Instead of just relying on Optical Stabilization alone. Not all lenses have Optical Stabilization due to very wide open apertures such as F/1.2 or F/2.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

stevet1 — Thu, 26 Sep 2024 10:23:18 GMT

I have been mulling this over and have not come to a conclusion.

One argument says that there is more of a tendency for camera shake with heavier cameras and lenses because your arms get tired and it's harder to hold your equipment still.

A counter argument says that there is more of a tendency for camera shake in lighter cameras and lenses because, due to its lighter weight, when you push the shutter button down down, it's easier to move the camera, and as Demetrius says, there is probably no IS in those short lenses at wide open apertures.

I've just been musing.

Steve Thomas

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

Tronhard — Thu, 26 Sep 2024 17:54:23 GMT

I think both arguments have in common is that the issue is technique in holding the camera with extended arms creating a far greater risk of camera movement.

Re: EOS RP photo aren't as sharp the ones from my EOS M50

kingsahibkhan — Thu, 26 Sep 2024 23:54:55 GMT

I uploaded photos from today. For two of them(the pic of the 2 ladies and the pic of the woman all the way in the back) the camera was on a 2 second timer on a hard surface. For the one labeled cuzzo, he was sat only 10 feet away from me and came out very soft.