topic Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4 in Camera Software

Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

BurnUnit — Sat, 24 Jun 2023 05:58:50 GMT

Here's a strange phenomenon that I somehow uncovered in DPP4 (V4.17.10.0) while editing some .CRW raw files from an old Canon Digital Rebel.

After making some adjustments (which are somewhat limited compared to what I can do with .CR2 files) I did a Batch Process to a group of shots to convert to .JPGs and save. No hiccups there as best as I can recall. But a few days later when reviewing the .JPGs this one, single, odd image in the batch showed up. In some areas that appeared overexposed, the blown-out highlights displayed as solid black in the JPGs, the same as seen in this first screen-shot of my saved .CRW file

I can't imagine missing that while editing the raw images, but maybe I dozed off for a few seconds. Or I got distracted when the phone rang. Or more likely, I pasted a recipe from a previous file and for some reason it took longer than normal for the adjustments to show up onscreen.

So I opened the .CRW file with the saved changes in DPP4 again and with the Highlights/Shadows warning enabled, this is what I see. Which wasn't all that surprising to me except for the fact that I didn't see it this way while doing the original editing. Also, what are obviously blown Highlights are displayed in blue instead of red because the adjustments I made rendered them as black, as shown in this second screen-shot.

In this final screenshot I disabled the Highlights/Shadows warning and backed down the Highlight slider to -5.0 from +1.0 and what do you know? The previously black highlight areas disappeared and I started to pull up at least a tiny bit more detail in the highlights. Saved my raw edits and converted to a .JPG again and the results look just like the re-edited .CRW this time.

What I'm figuring is that all this strange behavior is probably due to operator error on my part. But just in case, I'm curious if there might be some other distinct differences between .CRW and .CR2 files that I'm not aware of. Maybe something in the areas of dynamic range or sensor designs or in-camera processor types. I know I wasn't doing myself any favors by starting off with an overexposed image. But does it mean that this Digital Rebel is showing its age by "misbehaving" in a more evil, permanent way? Everything else about it seems to still be working properly, though I have no intentions of using it as a substitute for my 60D.

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

Peter — Sat, 24 Jun 2023 06:17:16 GMT

Upload an affected raw file and we can see if it is possible to recreate in DPP. Use a file host.

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

BurnUnit — Sat, 24 Jun 2023 23:40:05 GMT

Thanks for the quick reply!

https://wetransfer.com/downloads/419acfcb1caeb3d393d832eb539a5fa020230624232119/bd6d0fa98df646def5d26be61a307edc20230624232251/745cf3

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

jrhoffman75 — Sun, 25 Jun 2023 00:15:09 GMT

@BurnUnit wrote:
Thanks for the quick reply!
https://wetransfer.com/downloads/419acfcb1caeb3d393d832eb539a5fa020230624232119/bd6d0fa98df646def5d26be61a307edc20230624232251/745cf3

Something seems to have happened in DPP that is only readable by DPP.

I opened the file in Lightroom (LrC) and the white region shows as white with an RGB of 100,100,100, (totally burned out) with red highlight warning when triggered. LrC displays RGB as percent.

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

jrhoffman75 — Sun, 25 Jun 2023 00:25:42 GMT

I played with the brightness adjustment in DPP. When I moved it off "0" the black disappeared and the highlight warning was red. The RGB was 255,255,255. If I then started reducing the brightness the black appeared at -.10.

I deleted and redownloaded the file to start anew. In DPP I set the Brightness to "0" and used the Auto Gamma tool. It did a decent job of adjusting the image. In that tool the Highlights were set to -4.

Then I reset the Gamma tool and varied the brightness. It worked fine with no black appearing.

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

BurnUnit — Sun, 25 Jun 2023 07:37:21 GMT

Thanks for experimenting with it a bit in DPP4. You seem to be getting the kind of results I would have expected on my set-up in DPP4. But now I don't remember if I originally had made any Gamma adjustments. When I get some time I'll investigate further. I'm also behind some on updating my copy of DPP4 to the latest version, but I\d be surprised if the updates made any changes that affected working with old CRW files.

About the only other thing I noticed is that I couldn't make any lens correction adjustments, even with the Canon EF 85mm f1.8 lens that I used for this shot. But maybe that's the standard operating procedure with an older Digital Rebel and the CRW files. Maybe I'll try a few raw shots from my old G5 and see how they work. I think they were CRWs as well.

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

Peter — Sun, 25 Jun 2023 09:10:27 GMT

I hit Revert to shot settings and everything went normal. Seems like a bug in DPP about clipped highlights. All three channels in your raw file are clipped.

About lens identification I own 300D (same camera) and EF 85/1.8 and there is no LensType or LensModel in Exif.

Exif.CanonCs.LensType n/a
Exif.CanonCs.Lens 85.0 mm
Exif.CanonCs.MaxAperture F1.8
Exif.CanonCs.MinAperture F22

To identify the right lens you need to guess and have a list of lenses with the right focal length and the right max/min aperture values. For a lens like EF 85/1.8 that is not a problem because there is only one. But for something like 75-300 with all versions....

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

BurnUnit — Mon, 26 Jun 2023 00:54:32 GMT

I reopened the file in DPP4 and clicked the AUTO Gamma button like you did. You're right. It did a much better job than I expected! Usually I avoid using it because the results aren't pleasing. But I had made some manual gamma and brightness adjustments and think I may have been a little heavy-handed. In other words, I think I created at least part of my problems. Wouldn't be the first time. . . And I wish DPP4 had a "Midtone" slider in addition Highlights and Shadows.

My expectations going in were probably over-optimistic.I'm often amazed at the amount of improvement I can make with the newer CR2 files. But looking back I think that usually tends to be from opening up the shadows and futzing around with the midtones a bit. For something that's this over-exposed, the highlights just don't have enough image information to manipulate very much. I'm chalking the weirdness up to that and a bit of glitchy behavior from DPP4.

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

BurnUnit — Mon, 26 Jun 2023 01:12:02 GMT

Yep. It just looks like the Rebel/300D doesn't support any lens I.D. in the EXIF data. Though it reports the focal length and aperture that was used. The only other CRW files I've worked with were from a G5 which used a fixed lens.

Now if I can only figure out how to register my name into the Rebel's EXIF info . . .

Thanks for lending a hand!

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

jrhoffman75 — Mon, 26 Jun 2023 01:13:20 GMT

@BurnUnit wrote:
I reopened the file in DPP4 and clicked the AUTO Gamma button like you did. You're right. It did a much better job than I expected! Usually I avoid using it because the results aren't pleasing. But I had made some manual gamma and brightness adjustments and think I may have been a little heavy-handed. In other words, I think I created at least part of my problems. Wouldn't be the first time. . . And I wish DPP4 had a "Midtone" slider in addition Highlights and Shadows.
My expectations going in were probably over-optimistic.I'm often amazed at the amount of improvement I can make with the newer CR2 files. But looking back I think that usually tends to be from opening up the shadows and futzing around with the midtones a bit. For something that's this over-exposed, the highlights just don't have enough image information to manipulate very much. I'm chalking the weirdness up to that and a bit of glitchy behavior from DPP4.

You can move the middle slider in the gamma histogram as a midpoint slider. I don't really understand that tool but from what I read a number of years ago in a forum posting ( maybe DPR) that tool is very popular in Japan.

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

jrhoffman75 — Mon, 26 Jun 2023 01:27:50 GMT

@BurnUnit wrote:
Yep. It just looks like the Rebel/300D doesn't support any lens I.D. in the EXIF data. Though it reports the focal length and aperture that was used. The only other CRW files I've worked with were from a G5 which used a fixed lens.
Now if I can only figure out how to register my name into the Rebel's EXIF info . . .
Thanks for lending a hand!

You might be able to do it using Logipole Software Metadata ++

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

wq9nsc — Mon, 26 Jun 2023 01:46:39 GMT

I have noticed a color shift to bluish tinge in clipped areas when working in DPP with some files from my 1DX II and III bodies; it seems to be a weird issue that sometimes shows up in DPP with highly clipped RAW images.

I recently shot some photos in a fairly dim church and partway through the ceremony the priest, wearing beautiful white vestments, stepped into a beam of light coming through a skylight. I adjusted settings quickly to reduce the clipping issue and had to really bring up the shadows for the other participants to show. With the initial exposure settings he could be best described as looking like a smurf from another planet in the initial RAW conversion using DPP 🙂

Rodger

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

Peter — Mon, 26 Jun 2023 05:30:06 GMT

EosUtility or Gphoto2 (Linux/OS X) should be able to change your owner name. I have changed owner name in the older camera D30.

Re: Strange Results Editing .CRW Files In DPP4

BurnUnit — Wed, 28 Jun 2023 00:12:05 GMT

I think Canon dropped ZoomBrowser in favor of ImageBrowser EX. They don't show downloads for either available for Win10. Any EOS Utilities listed doesn't show compatibility with the Digital Rebel, though they mostly seem to cover things like WiFi connectivity and live video streaming for much newer models. I think I'm just trying jump too much of a gap between the Rebel and Win10.

I did somewhat get some versions of ZB ex and EOS Utility to install from the Canon CD that shipped with my 60D, but just about all the button are non-responsive or they won't recognize the old Rebel when connected. Nor will they allow me to upgrade them.

I'll look into Logipole a bit more. But what I've seen so far indicates to me that it adds EXIF data to your files after they're DL'd to your desktop. Mostly what I was hoping to do was tattoo my mane into the camera's memory.

If I decide to pursue this further at a later time I'll start a new thread here if I find myself in another jam.