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Honored Contributor
Posts: 5,426
Registered: ‎08-13-2015

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???


derekmccoy wrote:

I'm sorry, but I fail to see the relevance of having equal opposite black and white points.
What I normally do to maximise DR is set my desired exposure, drop my highlights and raise my shadows to taste, then hold Shift and double click on both Whites and Blacks to bring them just below clipping point. I then hold alt and pull the blacks slightly further down to bury them and get true black.

And yes, that duck shot would have been far cleaner with an 80D (which is the respective equal improvement everyone was expecting from the 6D2).


I agree. What you are doing is basically what I do.  It seems to work just fine.

 

EOS-1D Mark IV2017_07_160210.jpg

 

BTW, the duck shot was with an 7D2, though.   He just corrected me andd said that it began life underexposed by 5(?) stops.

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"I don't rent software. I use Photoshop CS6, ACR 9.8 and Lightroom 6.8 ."
Occasional Contributor
Posts: 18
Registered: ‎07-04-2014

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???

In a way I think it is kind of funny. I still shoot film (for fun) and use my Canon AT1 manual 35 mm which I believe I bought back around 1972. I loved shoot Tri-X 400 ASA as the film gave you excellent contrast and grain (which today we call noise). As far a dynamic range with film it was up to the film producer and the darkroom. I find it funny today as some have gotten into shooting film than scan the negatives or prints Not going to get a lot of dynamic range from that, that is for sure.  If I could have afforded a 5D MK4 I would have but that is out of the question. Every camera has a purpose. I'll know better once I get the camera.

 

James

Respected Contributor
Posts: 1,813
Registered: ‎02-26-2015

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???

[ Edited ]

derekmccoy wrote:

I'm sorry, but I fail to see the relevance of having equal opposite black and white points.
What I normally do to maximise DR is set my desired exposure, drop my highlights and raise my shadows to taste, then hold Shift and double click on both Whites and Blacks to bring them just below clipping point. I then hold alt and pull the blacks slightly further down to bury them and get true black.

And yes, that duck shot would have been far cleaner with an 80D (which is the respective equal improvement everyone was expecting from the 6D2).


The duck would not have been cleaner after being pushed 5 stops with the 80D. Despite what 'the test' says the 7D Mk II and the 80D have nearly identical real world dynamic range.

 

The reason you set the Black and Whites to equal values goes back to Ansel Adams and the Zone System. Proper exposure is in Zone 5, Middle Grey, which is half way between Zone 1 and Zone 9, You are setting the total exposure to extend from Zone 1 by just barely clipping the blacks, and Zone 9 by almost clipping the highlights. Thus the proper exposure is half way (equidistant) between those two.

Middle Grey 
Zone System.JPG

Respected Contributor
Posts: 1,813
Registered: ‎02-26-2015

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???


derekmccoy wrote:

 

I then hold alt and pull the blacks slightly further down to bury them and get true black.

 


That is the most import point I was making you need to clip the blacks to get true black.

Respected Contributor
Posts: 1,813
Registered: ‎02-26-2015

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???


Waddizzle wrote:

derekmccoy wrote:

I'm sorry, but I fail to see the relevance of having equal opposite black and white points.
What I normally do to maximise DR is set my desired exposure, drop my highlights and raise my shadows to taste, then hold Shift and double click on both Whites and Blacks to bring them just below clipping point. I then hold alt and pull the blacks slightly further down to bury them and get true black.

And yes, that duck shot would have been far cleaner with an 80D (which is the respective equal improvement everyone was expecting from the 6D2).


I agree. What you are doing is basically what I do.  It seems to work just fine.

 

EOS-1D Mark IV2017_07_160210.jpg

 

BTW, the duck shot was with an 7D2, though.   He just corrected me andd said that it began life underexposed by 5(?) stops.


WTF does a properly exposed duck have to do with this discussion. SMH

Let's see how your processing works on a photo that was 5 stops underexposed.

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 18
Registered: ‎07-04-2014

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???

Thanks - Again excellent description.  If anything this has been a great learning topic!

Honored Contributor
Posts: 5,426
Registered: ‎08-13-2015

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???


TTMartin wrote:

Waddizzle wrote:

derekmccoy wrote:

I agree. What you are doing is basically what I do.  It seems to work just fine.

 

EOS-1D Mark IV2017_07_160210.jpg

 

BTW, the duck shot was with an 7D2, though.   He just corrected me andd said that it began life underexposed by 5(?) stops.


WTF does a properly exposed duck have to do with this discussion. SMH

Let's see how your processing works on a photo that was 5 stops underexposed.


Five stops?  Sorry, I don't have any of those.  You really do have a terrible temper, BTW.  Good Day!

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"I don't rent software. I use Photoshop CS6, ACR 9.8 and Lightroom 6.8 ."
Occasional Contributor
Posts: 18
Registered: ‎07-04-2014

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???

Guys easy!! This was a good discussion. What ever works for you works. Besides being a amateur or hobbiest photography all my life I am a home brewer. I've learned thorugh the years there are many ways to make beer which is the same for photography. Many ways to shoot and process a photo. If it works for you that's all that count's. I saw Rick Salmon highlighting the 6D MKII. Thats seems like a good recommendation.   I'll know better when I get the camera.

New Contributor
Posts: 4
Registered: ‎07-30-2017

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???

Rick Salmon is paid by Canon, or at the very least gets free kit. He will never criticise their products being a "Canon Explorer of Light", a title that gets him boat loads of business.

Only you can decide if the upgrade is worthwhile considering there will be no IQ improvement. Is the improved AF and tilt screen worth the cost of three 6D's?

Its clear Canon has knee capped the 6D2 on purpose and wants users in the know to spend the extra grand for a 5D4.

Who knows, maybe Canon releases a firmware update to match the 5D4 output. Considering it's a lower MP sensor than the 5D4 it should produce better DR and noise performance, just like the 6D did vs the 5D3, but it's no better than the 4 year old model it's replacing.
Occasional Contributor
Posts: 18
Registered: ‎07-04-2014

Re: 6D MKII a disappointment???

Rick Salmon? That is a very good point. I guess I would think the same for those photographers who are Ambassadors for Sony, Fuji, etc. I indicated above that I don't want to switch to Sony or Fuji due to all the EF and EFS lens I have. I would have loved to splurge for the 5DMK4 but it is out of my price range. My daughter has an older 60D and may get my 6D. I have a T4i that I use as a back up and for any wild life (gets great tele-photo shots with EF lens).

 

James

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