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Honored Contributor
Posts: 7,436
Registered: ‎12-07-2012

Re: New member needs help

"I think the best solution is the 80D and the D30."

 

The "best" solution is the 7D Mk II.  The others are a compromise that can work.

A lot of Canon stuff. Along with, a lot of other stuff.
Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 4,383
Registered: ‎08-13-2015

Re: New member needs help


ebiggs1 wrote:

"I think the best solution is the 80D and the D30."

 

The "best" solution is the 7D Mk II.  The others are a compromise that can work.


That's the best solution for an experienced user, but not for someone new to DSLRs.

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"I don't rent software. I use Photoshop CS6, ACR 9.8 and Lightroom 6.8 ."
Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 2,850
Registered: ‎06-11-2013

Re: New member needs help


Waddizzle wrote:

ebiggs1 wrote:

"I think the best solution is the 80D and the D30."

 

The "best" solution is the 7D Mk II.  The others are a compromise that can work.


That's the best solution for an experienced user, but not for someone new to DSLRs.


While there are many differences and overall the 7D II is more of a technical (semi-pro) camera for experienced shooters, I think the most significant difference is that the 7D II has a very advanced focus system.  Someone purchasing that camera to exploit it's superior action-photography capabilities would need to be willing to invest the time to learn about the focus system, how to select focus points, how to change AF point modes & zones, and how to change focus mode behaviors.   If you invest the time to do this, then it will pay off because ultimately it offers more control in those areas.

 

 

It's not difficult *if* you are willing to invest the time to learn and practice.

 

If a person is not interested in investing the time, then the equipment will not magically produce better results on it's own.

 

Of course this applies to most DSLRs... they are capable of outperforming point & shoot cameras and phones, but without some knowledge of using exposure controls to influence the look of the shots, you wont necessarily get better looking images just because you have a DSLR.

 

Tim Campbell
5D III, 5D IV, 60Da
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 113
Registered: ‎01-31-2017

Re: New member needs help

As a beginner, I am finding this is an interesting thread. It isn't lost on me that the OP posted her query in the EOS Rebel section of the site. I assume the lady is a beginner, based on her questions. I don't know why an entry level DSLR isn't being recommended to her. As a beginner myself, I have seen and known too many of my compatriots read a few articles and then come in to the hobby with the mindset of "I need, I want, I must have...".

 

A month or two later, their expensive enthusiast gear is being sold on Craigslist or sitting in a closet collecting dust. Why? Too much camera, too soon.

 

She mentioned two interests. Taking photos of her granddaughter playing basketball and shooting birds. This can't be done on a T6?

 

I decided early on, that I wanted an entry level DSLR to learn photography on. Bought my refurbished T6 kit here on the Canon site and have been very pleased. It has exceeded my expectations. I literally learn something new each and every time I shoot. Don't need a 7D, 80D, or expensive glass for that.

 

I came in to the hobby with a range of interests. I shoot often. Over the past couple weeks, I've shot at tidepools, forests, a graveyard, parks, did a little street photography (yes, with a T6), and soon the desert. Once I am completely comfortable with the basics of general DSLR camera concepts and use, and am able to consistently produce good shots, then I have no doubt that I will move on to something better. Till then, I'm quite pleased with my purchase. YMMV.

 

 

Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 3,871
Registered: ‎11-13-2012

Re: New member needs help

Hi John_SD.

 

The big issue for the OP is the fact that the desire involed kayak use in salt water setting. The likelihood of damage to the equipment is great in those conditions, which is why I recommended the weathersealed 80D. One errant wave can destroy the T6s; for the price of less than two T6s bodies the weathersealed body is available.

 

 

 

 

John Hoffman
Conway, NH

1D X, Rebel T5i, Many lenses, Pixma PRO-100, MX472
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 113
Registered: ‎01-31-2017

Re: New member needs help


jrhoffman75 wrote:

 

One errant wave can destroy the T6s; for the price of less than two T6s bodies the weathersealed body is available. 

 


I'm sure you're right. The lady hasn't posted follow-up questions since her initial query, so it may all be moot at this point anyway. Or maybe she has made her purchase and moved on.

Frequent Contributor
Posts: 51
Registered: ‎02-12-2017

Re: New member needs help

It looks like I will need two cameras, one for kayaking and one for birding. Need to keep the cost down until ai find out if this is the hobby for me. Thanks for the answers.

Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 4,383
Registered: ‎08-13-2015

Re: New member needs help


lurechunker wrote:

It looks like I will need two cameras, one for kayaking and one for birding. Need to keep the cost down until ai find out if this is the hobby for me. Thanks for the answers.


Of course, I agree.  The current series of Rebel camera bodies are not as robust as they were in the past.  The T6 is truly an entry level camera.  Except for sensor resolution and limited Wi-Fi features, the T6 is not very different from a T1i.  But, a T6 is not as well built as a T1i, IMHO.  

 

None of the current Rebel bodies are as well built as a T1i.  If you can find a new 70D, then go for that.  The 80D is truly a family camera, with video capabilities that are state of the art.  The 80D is pretty good in low light, and seems to be underrated.  In fact, I think it performs as least as well in low light as the 7D2, if not better.  The 80D produces images with noise levels that are surprisingly low, which makes it great for video with inexpensive lenses.

 

The T6s and T6i are not as well built, and lack the focusing system of the 80D.  The T6 offers even less than its' big brothers.  current Rebel bodies can take good pictures, but handle them with care.  Keep them away from dust and water.  Beware of smoke at the backyard BBQ with a Rebel.  

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"I don't rent software. I use Photoshop CS6, ACR 9.8 and Lightroom 6.8 ."
Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 4,383
Registered: ‎08-13-2015

Re: New member needs help


lurechunker wrote:

It looks like I will need two cameras, one for kayaking and one for birding. Need to keep the cost down until ai find out if this is the hobby for me. Thanks for the answers.



lurechunker wrote:

It looks like I will need two cameras, one for kayaking and one for birding. Need to keep the cost down until ai find out if this is the hobby for me. Thanks for the answers.


I will be brutally honest with you.  Birding can be an expensive hobby.  Period.  If you wish to shoot birds in the wild, then you will need a lens with a focal length of at least 400mm to 600mm.  Those lenses are not cheap.  

 

You can get shots of birds with budget lenses, but you will need to be so close that you will likely disturb the birds.  Of course, it helps to get lucky from time to time. 

 

Tracking birds in flight, is a practiced skill.  Lots of practice.  Having a camera body with many Auto-Focus tracking points is a BIG assist.  The 80D has 45 AF points.  The Rebel bodies have only 9, and do not track a subject in motion very well, if at all.  

 

Lenses are MUCH better today than when the T1i was released, even the budget lenses.  But, the high performance lenses can produce truly breath taking images when used with camera bodies with high performance AF systems..  

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"I don't rent software. I use Photoshop CS6, ACR 9.8 and Lightroom 6.8 ."
Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 2,850
Registered: ‎06-11-2013

Re: New member needs help


lurechunker wrote:

It looks like I will need two cameras, one for kayaking and one for birding. Need to keep the cost down until ai find out if this is the hobby for me. Thanks for the answers.


"Need" is a strong word.  Several years ago, I recall someone's wife (I don't think it was on this forum) who stated that she was looking for a camera and lens for her husband who declared "you see that bird?  I want a camera that can take a photo of that bird with up-close detail with me having to step out of my car."  I responded that "you're in luck!  B&H Photo has a used copy of the Canon EF 1200mm f/5.6 USM lens... and it's only $130,000.00

 

If you have the resources and are willing to part with the money, the options are staggering.  

 

If you want to take photos of non-moving subjects in the middle of a bright day...any camera will do this and get fantastic results.  

 

What separates DSLRs from point & shoots is the level of control you have.  By changing lenses you can generally select a lens with a very low focal ratio -- and this produces a deliberately shallow depth of field such that you get a tack-sharp subject with a gorgeously blurred background and the contrast in focus really helps the subject pop.  You can't do that with a camera phone or a point & shoot camera.   You can control all aspects of the exposure which allows for a more creative result.

 

Scott Kelby did a seminar in which he (jokingly) mentions that if you want to get into action photography, you'll need a suitcase full of money to start.  This is an area where you need particularly long focal length lenses with very low focal ratios and technical cameras with advanced focusing systems that have staggeringly fast frame rates when shooting bursts of continuous shots.  That level of performance means you're basically looking for top-end gear.

 

Can you capture fantastic sports & action photos with an entry level camera?  Absolutely you can... but your "keeper ratio" will be lower.  The higher end gear will get you a higher keeper ratio.  The trick with birds, however, is they may be shy.  Depending on the bird, you may not be able to get within a hundred yards of them.  Other birds may allow you to get within just a few feet.

 

The EOS "Rebel" line are the entry series cameras where a body + lens combination will generally cost less than $1000.  

 

"Today", I own several camera bodies and a number of top-end lenses... but I didn't just buy it all at once.  I've been slowly accumulating gears, as budget allowed, over many years.   When you buy a point & shoot, you're buying a "camera" and it will never be more than it was on the day of original purchase.  When you buy a DSLR, you're just buying into the foundation of a "camera system" and you'll be able to acquire more lenses, lighting, and other accessories, and even upgrade the body ... all over time. 

Tim Campbell
5D III, 5D IV, 60Da
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